Natural Aquarium attempt - 16/06/2015 (pics)

[Andy Thurston]

Hi jaap keep an eye on your ottos they will tell you if your co2 is too high
As you have already noticed they dont move as much when co2 is very high and also their gills will become pink/red before they slow down
Have a look at this page of my journal it has some good pics of ottos
http://www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/andys-60l-cube.31194/page-7
Shrimp tend to lie on their side and die when theres too much co2, either that or jump out of the tank

 

[Alexander Belchenko]

IMO, 3 guppies are not enough to be 100% sure.

 

[Jaap]

IMO, 3 guppies are not enough to be 100% sure.

What do u suggest?

 

[Bhu]

I'm loosing armano shrimp right now my co2 is lime green by checker. But I have much more sensitive fish in there cardinal tetras and a pair of discus; which are enjoying eating the said dying armanos. I've lost 4 in 2 days. Maybe due to me dosimg liquid co2 at too high a concentration to kill BBA. Fish including corys and otos are all fine! Red cherry shrimp are fine too. Maybe the armano are more sensitive than we think! Luckily I had 25 so still got a good 20 in there

 

[Andy Thurston]

My amano shrimp were ok with 3.5x liquid carbon dose

 

[Bhu]

That's good to know. I've been thinking this evening that it's maybe my discus being naughty and killing them. I've only just added them to this planted tank and the shrimps maybe need to learn to keep away as they had the run of it until now. The discus came from a tank that had shrimps but you never see them they hide and must feed at night. When I took the discus out I found loads of shrimps in there that I never knew I had!

 

[Alexander Belchenko]

What do u suggest?

I'd probably do 50% water change and put air pump for night aeration for at least one week. I know most UKAPS members slightly against air pumps, but these are good for my tanks and much simpler to use.

And also, what's your routine to acclimatise new fish/shrimp for your water chemistry? I found amano shrimps very picky about changing water parameters, usually they escape from the tank the night after I put them it if I don't acclimatise them long enough, at least 1-2 day wiith slowly adding water from my main tank to small carantine tank. I also put air pump there, to be sure new livestock won't fall short on oxygen.

 

[Jaap]

Day 87!

The light is at 35cm from substrate now for about one week now.

The tank has 3 guppies and 3 otos.

I have some algae now...I am not sure what types of algae I have but I think its 3 different ones.

BBA which I possibly got because I stopped dosing Excel and also I have decreased the CO2 injection a bit. So I had both co2 fluctuations and lowered co2.

Diatoms

And on the Staurogyne Repens and Montecarlo I can't recognise it

Some help on the identification of the 3 algaes and some suggestions on how ro overcome the situation please!

Thanks!

 

[Bhu]

Definitely BBA and diatoms, the picture is not clear for the 3rd type. Id increase water changes, increase co2 again. you wont like it but reduce the light if you have a dimmer. SAE are very good at eating that type of algae well the bba for sure but can grow up to 6" (not sure if your aquarium can handle that, also they jump out of the tank so you need a lid) and you need the real SAE not the flying fox or Chinese one.

It really is a fine balance! Im working on this too, I get GSA and BBA and im trying to get the right balance between light and co2 with lots of flow.

I also just added red ramshorn snails which are meant to keep the BBA away and eat lots of algae. Waiting to find a real SAE myself...

 

[Jaap]

Definitely BBA and diatoms, the picture is not clear for the 3rd type. Id increase water changes, increase co2 again. you wont like it but reduce the light if you have a dimmer. SAE are very good at eating that type of algae well the bba for sure but can grow up to 6" (not sure if your aquarium can handle that, also they jump out of the tank so you need a lid) and you need the real SAE not the flying fox or Chinese one.

It really is a fine balance! Im working on this too, I get GSA and BBA and im trying to get the right balance between light and co2 with lots of flow.

I also just added red ramshorn snails which are meant to keep the BBA away and eat lots of algae. Waiting to find a real SAE myself...

Ok so even though I have diatoms and bba, for certain plants my growth is not that good. For example hemianthus micranthemoides is barely growing and it was barely growing when my CO2 levels were through the roof. So my only guess is that bba was caused by unstable co2 and that me plants still don't show signs of good growth because of low light levels.

Sanj from this forum said that he measured the par for Grobeam 600 at 40cm and he got 35 micromols. I am now at 35cm but with a glass lid in between the light and the substrate which means I am guessing I am between 25 and 35 micromols...so together with very little growth and the fact that I am in the range of 25-35 micromols I am thinking maybe I should lower the light down to 30cm...

 

[Bhu]

your Staurogyne Repens looks like it is growing really well now. A lovely green too! Carpet plants are hard to grow unless you have a very high tech tank that's balanced to perfection. How about adding another growbeam 600 but reduce the intensity, such that you get a more focused spread? Just an idea might make it worse! Im still in experiment phase myself! The hardest thing is getting the co2 right and once that's done at least it will be stable and that will get rid of a lot of other issues from the algae side. I use 2 x aquagrow but I have a deeper tank.

 

[Bhu]

Also if you think it is down to the light, maybe try a different set up. T5 or a different led. That might work better for you

 

[Jaap]

Also if you think it is down to the light, maybe try a different set up. T5 or a different led. That might work better for you

Well at the moment I can still go closer to the substrate a further 10cm so I can have more light in that sense. However I am not sure if this is the best thing to do considering i have all sorts of algae on one side and on the other side I have little growth...

 

[Jaap]

Yesterday I decided to clean my filter after 90 days of no filter maintenance....well I thought it shouldn't be dirty, I only have plants! I couldn't have been more mistaken! The filter was filled with dirt, dead plants, gravel, snails and God know what....I washed everything away with tank water and the filter was clean again. I think it did make a difference in water clarity but it might be my imagination...placebo effect

I am happy I cleaned the filter, still have all sorts of algae and I hope the 3 Otos I have will help out....I am getting myself 5 red cherry shrimp as well....I don't want to change anything now but after a week or so I think I will be lowering my lights further down to the substrate....I thing it the light that is main factor of little growth.

pH Profile:
11:00 - CO2 ON - 7.96
12:00 - 6.94
13:00 - 6.75
14:00 - Lights ON - 6.60
15:00 - 6.60
16:00 - 6.60
17:00 - 6.60
18:00 - 6.60
19:00 - 6.60
20:00 - 6.60
21:00 - CO2 OFF - 6.60
22:00 - Lights OFF - 6.75

I think my CO2 looks good....circulation also is 100% good....a 1000l/h filter with a spray bar positioned just a few cm below water surface for a 40L tank is more than enough.

Nutrients I am overdosing in a sense using EI....just a few grams more in my solution....

So the remaining culprit is LIGHTS!

It would explain the fact that hemianthous micrathemoides isn't growing bushy but instead grows upwards....the same for hydrocotile triparti....and also fissidens is dark dark green and not growing at all...

 

[Alexander Belchenko]

I read opinion from one ada-loving guy thart BBA loves dirty filter. I.e. if you suddenly got BBA bloom you should check and clean your canister.

 

[Jaap]

I read opinion from one ada-loving guy thart BBA loves dirty filter. I.e. if you suddenly got BBA bloom you should check and clean your canister.

So now that the filter is clean will the bba go away or will I have to remove it manually?

 

[parotet]

Hi Jaap

Co2 seems ok, so to really make sure it is not a lack of nutrients just double dose during some weeks (that's what I did, then adjust backwards). Despite of what can be read in other forums regarding canister cleaning (some people say they "preserve" the microbes by not cleaning the caister in a year) I think it is very important to clean it frequently. There are very good threads from Darrel explaining why canisters should only work aerobically. Additionally most of the hobbyist here will tell you that having a dirt canister multiplies the chance of having algae issues.

Lights is of course an important issue. If I am not wrong you have gone from dark to very bright in a few weeks... it took me 6 months to go from 40 cm to the current 15 cm above the water level (using a light fixture which is probably less bright than yours and in a larger tank). My rule of thumb is, move 5 cm each 10-15 days and stop if you notice any problem. During this long time, plants have time to adapt (they don't adapt in a few hours/day) and the most important thing: you have time to adapt your setup to the new light conditions.

Looking at your pictures I also think you need more biomass. I have noticed that there is a kind critical biomass in my tanks from which everything becomes easier (if you have previously solved all your problems, other wise it is a big mess)... I think your tank could not be considered as a densely planted tank (in some places it is said that a densely planted tank is the one to which you look from above and you can only see a 10-15% of the substrate). I would introduce some really easy and fast growing stem plants (don't make your life more complicated with difficult plants), just as a temporary stage of your tank... afterwards, you can go for complicated ones.

Jordi

 

[Alexander Belchenko]

So now that the filter is clean will the bba go away or will I have to remove it manually?

You should remove it as much as you can, but clean filter helps prevent it coming back, as I understand it.

 

[Jaap]

Hello,

So now I have BBA and some diatoms. I think the diatoms are subsiding since I cleaned the filter last week. However, the BBA isnt backing down. My co2 levels are now stable or at least I think they are stable because I havent changed injection.

1. If the weather ir changing and temperatures are dropping then unavoitably the water temperature changes which means more co2 is kept in the aquarium. So if one day the weather is hot and the other day its colder then co2 levels are different from one day to the other, does that mean flactuating co2?

2. I see that the plants are still hardly growing most possibly due to low light levels. I have BBA so now do I lower the lights from 35cm to 30cm or do I do nothing until I find a way to get rid of BBA?

Thanks

 

[Jaap]

Day 104!

As you can see things are getting worse with BBA...

02/11/2014

09/11/2014

I have tried to do 30% water changes every two days for the past week. The water looks clearer but the BBA grows even more.

I know BBA is CO2 related and its either due to low CO2 or fluctuations in CO2. Weel I don't have any fluctuations in CO2. The pH is stable from 7.51 to 6.41 and remains at 6.41 until lights off. Tom Barr told me that a drop of 1 pH unit means I have injected 30ppm of CO2 aproximately. Maybe it isn't enough. So today I have increased CO2 by a notch and the pH is at 6.24 with the fish doing fine.

The light has remained at 35cm from the substrate for 3 weeks now and the past week I have lowered intensity to 90%.

Here is a video of the co2 system, where I have an inline diffuser going into the inflow of the filter and a reactor attached to the outflow to ensure that any co2 escaping is dissolve completely. I also think that for a 40L tank this co2 injection rate is mad! Just take a look at the bubbles per second.



At this point I am stuck. I don't know what else to do to stop BBA from growing.

Thanks