melting ambulia

[8ball]

i have recently set up a new tank at my place of work - so budget was an issue. the substrate is jbl manadoo with clay balls (i think they are called kugel) i use easycarbo daily and profito weekly. lighting is by twin t5.
plant species are hygro, amazons swords, sagittaria and ambulia (l. sessiflora)
all were mail order and arrived very small and unimpressive - however all have grown on well and, several trims and replants later, things were going ok, until now !
i have noticed over the last few weeks that 2 or 3 stems of the ambulia, in the middle of perfectly healthy stems, started to collapse from the top downwards. the growing tips shrivel, the leaves droop and then the stem melts away.
this was not a major worry, just confusing as i don't know anyone who has had trouble growing ambulia (including myself in several other tanks before!) but i noticed at the end of last week that many of the stems appeared to be drooping and on arrival at work today over half of the planted area has collapsed, broken away and floated to the surface !!
all other plants are fine (exept the red amazon which doesn't stay red for long - not surprising considering the lack of nutrient in the substrate)
the only thing i can come up with is that i have heard some true aquatics don't do well with liquid carbon, although i will admit to not fully understanding this.
can anyone help ? i would really appreciate your thoughts.

 

[AndyOx]

hi there, I had replied previously but I think the gremlins got my message. I had ambulia melt when I was using easy carbo. They looked fine initially then suddenly it was leaves everywhere!

 

[8ball]

cheers for your response, it's good to know i'm not the only one that has had a problem with ambulia !!!!
i have since read about the emerse leaf form of ambulia so my original comment about 'true' aquatics is off the mark.
it must be something to do with the easycarbo though
would be nice to hear from someone with a bit more knowledge on this - please !!

 

[8ball]

easycarbo expert needed !!!

i currently have a topic on the plant section titled 'melting ambulia'
i have never had a problem with this plant but am now growing it in a tank that i am dosing with easycarbo and profito.
it was growing very strongly at first but then started to collapse, from the top down. i have now lost about 80% of the stems.
i have heard about some plants having adverse reactions to easycarbo but i don't understand why !
i would really appreciate some info on this please.

 

[ceg4048]

Hi 8ball,
I appreciate that you're keen to receive a response to your query, but double posting is considered a heinous crime punishable by paper cuts inflicted on the webbing of the fingers, followed by having lemon juice poured over the cuts. I've merged the two threads into one. Kindly refrain from double posting. A polite bump on the original thread will do.

There are only a few plants that are confirmed to consistently respond poorly to Excel/Easycarbo. The active ingredient in these products is called gluteraldehyde, and you can search the forum for this term to learn more about it. It is a sterilizing agent and is therefore toxic, however the toxicity in all plants is dosage dependent. Liverworts and bladderworts do not do well. Riccia has a low threshold. Some people report that Vallis responds poorly while other report no negative effects. Again, it is possible that the dosage wash higher for those who report negative effects. Likewise the reports of gluteraldehyde's effect on Limnophilia Sessiflora (Ambulia) are mixed. Some people report issues while other report no negative effects.

Because of toxicity, It is a generally accepted practice to limit the Liquid carbon dosage to bottle instructions, although some of us use routinely dose 2X or even 3X the bottle recommendation when fighting algae or when wanting to boost growth. Again, this depends on the tanks contents. Sensitive species react negatively to high dosages.

Generally, plants turning brown, melting, disfiguring, turning glassy or transparent is a sign of poor CO2. Poor CO2 occurs when the lighting intensity is too high and/or when the flow or distribution of water around the plants is poor.

Since poor CO2 occurs with much greater regularity than does negative reaction to liquid carbon it should always first be suspected that you have the poor CO2.

In order to address this, normally one would increase the CO2, which in this case, means increasing the liquid carbon, however, since the liquid carbon is under suspicion, it is a safer procedure to first lower the light intensity by disabling a bulb. Lowering the light intensity will lower the demand for CO2. You might also consider whether your flow/distribution needs reworking as well.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,

 

[8ball]

ok ok - i absolutely don't want to experience the paper-cut and lemon juice thing - but i didn't think i was double posting !! i know i mentioned my other thread but the emphasis of the topic had changed. originally i was asking for ideas - nutrient, light, easycarbo etc then with a response mentioning similar issues with easycarbo i felt i needed more info so posted a new thread under co2 to try and appeal to a more specialised audience. anyhow - lessons learned and all that !!

excellent information on the easycarbo and very appreciated. you have tied together the bits of info i have previously picked up on.
as i've only been dosing the minium amount i think i will start with the lighting
cheers