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"Dutch something or the other" 120 Gal

Replanted the UG:

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Going to allow some of the stems to recover and sprout new top growth, then fill in this section more, removed the Gloss rug finally.

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LondonDragon said:
Any reason for replanting it Tom, it was looking great and healthy :)
Amazing tank btw, nice to see some great reds in the tank :)
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120$ in plant sales reason enough?

It starts to pile up if I do not mow it like a grass lawn, this means I cannot sell anything also and have to net out the trimmings.

I can go either way with the methods, and deciding which method to trim a particularly species, and why.....is a personal matter for many folks, perhaps you do not want to sell the plants, then it will matter less, perhaps once every 3-4 months, it's good to get in there and straighten things out well?

I try a few different things for plant trim methods, then decide what works best for a particular species, this does not imply that it is the best/only recommended way, just for myself, for this tank right now........it is.
 
Radik said:
I want ashy pipeworth and tonina, I really like them a lot.
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I'm really bothered by not having a good location and space for the lotus blossom Tonina though.

I have 3 species of Erio's(well type 1 E setaceum and type 3, might be the same species) so that's plenty.
I wanted to go with the Tonina due to the brighter green color vs the Syngonanthus genus which I've avoided for a person reason, I've had way too much of it in the past.

There is a neat smaller short version, but I grow all these together some time ago.
Manaus and Belem and the new "ururapes" is nice.

There is a Piluaria americana I'd like to get.

Also considered some rows of Isoetes, this looks pretty nice an they are easy to care for.
 
I can't find tonina belem anywhere they are really nice plants but harder to grow. Where u got your erios from I know there is also some ashy pipe with red color inside some japan version it looks just stunning but never seen it for sale.
 
Radik said:
I can't find tonina belem anywhere they are really nice plants but harder to grow. Where u got your erios from I know there is also some ashy pipe with red color inside some japan version it looks just stunning but never seen it for sale.
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I am honestly not as up to date with the various species of these more prostrate type Erios, nor do I think many of the sellers are either, most are coming in from Asian sellers and then end up here on the West coast of the USA, mostly because we have a large Asian Population here.

I do not find them hard to grow at all, the Sygnonanthus belem and mananus etc are tougher to grow IME/IMO, Tonnia is a little less so, but harder to propagate new stems.


Still, these are some of the so called hardest stem plants to grow available, and I have them all in one tank.
No issues other than cutting them and trimming them often 8)
 
Tonight I did a good sized hack to the rear section and moves some of the greens farther back and then pulled some of the reds up to the wall of weeds in the midground, this should add more red and more contrast with the green species in the front/mid ground area.
 
New ideas and changes:

Once some of the plants for the rows grow out a bit more, I'll allow a wall of red in the first layer in the background plants, mostly R wallichii and macrandra.

Right where the wood sort of divides the tank, right behind that.

I need to pull the Hydrothrix back as it is rather weedy and it clashes with the similar Erio type 3(giant E. setaceum). I thought this would look good and it does at the first wall of weeds in the back section, but the tank is more about color, so a wall of red might be even more "flashy". the Hydrothrix can be in the back and still do quite well and form a thicket easily.

This will add much more red to the front of the tank and add a nice wild mauve color not present in the other red plants in the foreground rows.
So it serves a couple of purposes in the color scheme and macrandra is a weed, so may as well put it.... to work.

The large Erio type 3 is doing well/much better this time. I am feeding the Fire shrimp a lot and the plant was much better acclimated this time, so the shrimp seemed to attack only wimpy plants, but not a healthy Erio setacem, I also have the normal type 1 Erio so it was NOT the shrimp, it was the health of the plant and feeding the shrimp well. It can be hard to tell if it was or was not the shrimp, feeding, or just the overall condition when the plants came in, or my own environmental changes perhaps. I cannot say, but these would be my guesses. So both of these types are now growing very well in the tank and are multiplying quickly. Ah why not blame the shrimp for my issues eh??

This is good news because I wanted a large showy fine needled plant like the Erio type 3. I need to find a hole for the Type 1 Erio now. Likely will have to scratch one off the list of plants in the tank. I likely will also do the same for the Tonina lotus blossom. Just cannot see anywhere to place them.
Hydrothrix will do fine in the rear section, but the Erios are not as likely to do as well back there. Nor the Tonina lotus blossom.

I bought some so called mini Bolbitus. I think it survives underwater, but it does not grow much if at all. I placed it in an optimal spot, has hardly produced any growth in almost 2 months.

The Low grow Red Hygro is starting to creep along the sediment, and will fill in I guess in about 1-2 months very nicely in the L rear corner.
I placed the Nesaea crassiculius in the rear, it was stunted when I got it and some decent side shoots formed. Not sure if it's worth my efforts to coax it back or just toss it. It'd have to be one of those foreground row plants to look really nice. Those spots are pretty much filled.

I'll stick with some Ammannia gracilius for that spot in the rear.
The Mermaid weed looked okay, but it was not as bushy in feel and the Ammannia will add a nicer look IME.
So getting closer to the goal, and adding more color and keeping the contrast, working through which plant species works best in each spot relative to the other.

The other plant up for color consideration is the Nesaea pedicillata which I've not kept for about 10 years now, a nice yellow longer narrow leaf might find a home in the rear middle of the tank or behind the wood truck perhaps.

Worth a try.
 
did some hacking and moving:

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I'll end up with some thick groups in a couple of weeks, but things are moving along. I moved some R macrandra so it will grow into a red mauve wall, I'll fatten up the R wallichii in the corner. Removed a few stragglers: Nesaea crassiculius, Mermaid weed, Crypt parva. I might add the C. parva back, but perhaps on the other Right hand side.

I moved the Tonina's on opposite sides of the tank so they do not clash. The stumps I have left after the sales will grow in pretty well in this location. They also look good against the Fissidens and I plan to keep them fairly short and make it a nice thick forest of stems, but not so tall, they distract or hide the fissidens or Erios behind them.

Some of the groups are a bit messy, but as they grow out and get another trim or two, these will even up nicely.

I'm very close to having the species and their locations finalized.
It has taken awhile and there's still some growing and trimming to do be done to fill the spots in better. I did finally get some Ammannia gracilius from a local so no matter what, I have the species set I want/need. The Ammannia will look awesome where I have it planned in the rear. A much better choice than the mermaid weed or the Nesaea.

The only other plant, also the same local guy has it, is the N pedicillata, a nicer red/yellow color might lend well to some spots.

I also found a good holding spot for all those errant pieces of Fissidens moss that I keep finding everywhere: the tops of the driftwood that poke out, they can easily lay on that, get enough water, a ton of light and grows very well there. After 3-4 weeks, I'll pull them off and sell the moss. Simple, clean, easy and out of the way.
 
I've just had a great Sunday morning reading through this after rather neglecting it!

Inspirational, informative and above all so vivid!

But with all that colour I'm totally smitten with the Erio Cinereum - I've seen it before on the web but never worked out what it was.

Anyone selling that in the UK? Difficult to grow? I can't see much info online. I see it's from Australia, likes cooler waters and quite high light and once it flowers it dies.
 
Never had any issues with it myself. The temps are pretty warm, 27-29C.
Never had it flower.
Should be a few people selling it in the UK I'd think.
 
Yea, it is a bit gaudy eh

Damn yanks, we are good at that:)

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A few good trims and grow out and the front rows will be up to snuff at least. I need to grow out the Ammannia more in the rear, but the R macrandra is coming along well, the older lower leaves are pretty pale, but a few trims later, they will be all red and make a nice mid wall in the back there.

One trick is to allow the plants to grow up and hit the surface for about a week or so, then replant. I have not yet done this with this tank, but plan to later.

The Downoi is making a come back, all I had were trimmed off bottom stumps, so it's come a long long way and will fill in decently.

Some of the other plants will grow in nicely and I've found using a turkey baster works well to clean the Erio cinreums' middle parts and keep those cleaner.

I am pondering adding the Red serpae tetras to this tank and moving the Rainbows. The tetras will eat the smaller shrimp for sure though, which I thought the rainbows would, but..they have not yet.

You can see part of the wall of Red macrandra and where I am going with this idea.
 
Those reds are mental! The most intense I think I've ever seen.

I assume this a a combination of the actual plant health and colour rendition from the T5 lamps?

What are your thoughts on limiting nitrogen to induce reds, Tom? Your tank makes this theory sound nonsensical!
 
George Farmer said:
Those reds are mental! The most intense I think I've ever seen.

I assume this a a combination of the actual plant health and colour rendition from the T5 lamps?

What are your thoughts on limiting nitrogen to induce reds, Tom? Your tank makes this theory sound nonsensical!
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The irony is I'm the one that suggested and showed that low N enhances reds, but through stress, not good growth/horticulture, but that's(N stress) not what is going on here.

I'd say you are correct, good overall health and care of the plants..........and the lighting is rather wild.
I have tried quite a few different bulb combo's, and ..........I can get much more intense reds than these actually........if I loaded up with the redder bulbs and used the URI sun and then the Coralife colormax's etc.......then the reds would look even more intense and reflective a large %.

Low color temp bulbs will reflect more red.

But, this tank is well fertilizers at a rich ppm, roughly 45ppm as week as NO3 and then there is ample N from the soil still, but this is declining now. Fish/shrimp are well fed also, so there's at least another 5-15ppm a week there as NH4/NO3.

PO4 is sitting at 5ppm 3x a week, Fe as proxy for all traces: 0.4ppm dosed 4-5x a week.
K will be over 50ppm added a week.

Water changes are at 50% 2x a week for now.
 
Did a real nice big hack today, I love this because it means I do not need to do much for awhile and the other plants get plenty of light, CO2 and the tank's flow patterns are nice.

I'll get a pic up perhaps Sat evening.

The C parva is likely going to be removed finally.
I'll allow the Downoi to trace over that direction like the Rios do.

I plan on keeping the L peruensis lower and use a combo of topping and uprooting/shortening other stems. I also do this now with the Ludwigia "red" as well.

I'd tried the Hydrothrix in a pretty low light region that was blocked by the main wood and it stared to rot a little, so I pulled that and like will return the Myrio matogrossense and allow the Bolbitus to fill out around the bottom base. The elephant nose double trunk loves that spot to hide during the day.

So now it's a wait and watch the weeds grow for awhile game.
As they fill in, I'll fatten up some groups and just maintain others......
Each trim is one step closer and better to the goal. Even the goal is rather open ended and experimental, which is nice for a change.
 
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