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Alleopathy

nickmcmechan

Member
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16 Mar 2008
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Location
Dalkeith, Scotland
Just read the chapter in Diana Walstads book on Alleopathy and wondered what the opinions / observations / experiences were?

It seems from this chapter that algae can produce alleopathic chemicals that inhibit plant growth and that plants can do the same to algae. I know I'm preachng to the converted but heavily planted tanks with healthy growth inhibit algae via Alleopathy

Also it's suggested that some plants may inhibit others. I'd be interested in experiences with this?

In my current low tech set up everything has done well but the bacopa completely melted. After reading the chapter I wonder if this coincided with crypt melt. The crypts have recovered after acclimating as expected but the bacopa is long gone and has been replaced with alternatha and ludwigia.
 
Hi all,
ust read the chapter in Diana Walstads book on Alleopathy and wondered what the opinions / observations / experiences were?
It seems from this chapter that algae can produce alleopathic chemicals that inhibit plant growth and that plants can do the same to algae. I know I'm preachng to the converted but heavily planted tanks with healthy growth inhibit algae via Alleopathy
It is really difficult to prove allelopathic responses in vivo, and not all plant scientists believe that they even exist.

Have a look at <http://www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/why-is-bigger-plant-mass-better.31095/#post-327472> I've changed my view a bit after reading some of the newer papers, and I now think the likelihood is that alleopathy does occur.

cheers Darrel
 
As Darrel says some plant scientists write about alleopathy as though it's a given fact, while others consider it hokum. I subscribe to the former school of thought, and for that matter always have:p
Triffids aside, plants are sedentary organisms and I think many species are capable of using alkaloids to exert some influence over their immediate environment...since they can't run away if conditions become unfavourable.
 
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Allelopathy seems to make sense to me, but I'm certainly no expert by any means

Crypts and vals seem to come up in forums a lot as an example
 
Hi,
I'm in the hogwash camp and that's because I've not seen any evidence of it. I can intentionally trigger some forms of algal bloom and then intentionally get rid of it, and none of that requires alleopathy. It simply requires a combination of the basics. So the whole talk about alleopathy is problematic because those having problems in their tank will rush to their favorite cause, like lemmings, instead of performing the proper steps to improve the health of their tank. Polluted water, for example contributes to the triggers of algal blooms, and at the same time reduces the level of Oxygen in the surrounding area. I would rather the focus to be on keeping your tank clean by extreme water changes. That way you remove any trace of potential alleopathic chemicals while minimizing the risk of hypoxia, so it effectively becomes a non issue. If you don't keep the tank clean then people can argue till the cows come home about what chemical caused the algae or killed the plant or fish.

The function of algae is to clean up the environment. It's not to make your life miserable. They really do not care about poisoning other plants just so that they can dominate the scene. That really isn't their programming. That's another reason people have trouble understanding that nutrients don't cause algae. The future of algae is guaranteed by the duality of their nature. They can live for thousands of years as spores. They really have no interest in the vegetative state per se because it's energy expensive. They can travel the globe and re-populate almost at will, just as spores. The deterioration of an environment, such as a poorly managed tank, gives them an opportunity to bloom, for the express purpose of producing more spores, which will live, almost forever. So algae could care less about alleopathy because they rule the planet (we only think we do) and their future is ensured by the fact that they are spores.

Having said all that, BGA and some types of flagellates are known to release deadly toxins. Red tide is a famous example, but these are bacteria and phytoplanktonic.

Also important to note is that generally, plants are not just sitting there looking pretty. They actively change their environment to suit their needs. The thousands of chemical reactions that they initiate could, in some way be considered alleopathic, but really there is little relevance in looking at it this way. Plants are the ones responsible for the very Oxygen we breathe, for example. They Oxygenate the soil and in so doing exclude certain types of aneaerobic microorganisms within their rhizosphere. Is that alleopathic? Maybe.

The 21% Oxygen that is part of the atmosphere was put there strictly by photosynthesizing plants and bacteria, and most of the work is done these days by the great forests of the world and as well by Diatomic algae. So you might want to consider that the next diatom bloom you get, and be thankful that they are so resilient and that you have so much trouble killing them. That's actually a good sign.

Cheers,
 
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I've always used Ceratophyllum (hornwort) in new tanks when available, due to its apparent allelopathic effect on algae. I do remember reading that some studies supported this ability of Ceratophyllum, but it could also just be that it's such a fast growing plant.
 
Hi, I'm in the hogwash camp

Haha...I already knew that:rolleyes: but it sounds very much like you're talking yourself in to the...I'm a believer camp:p Either way you're absolutely right there is no substitute for good tank husbandry; I'm sure no one would disagree with you there.
 
When I read walstad, this chapter about alleopathy also rang a bell.it's interesting idea that plants "fight" for whatever they need against other plants (taller and perhaps faster growing etc) releasing chemicals. Obviously hard to prove and not even priority to consider when doing a planted tank but and interesting idea :) agree with cliff as usual but that walstad lady it's worth a read I think.

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When I read walstad, this chapter about alleopathy also rang a bell.it's interesting idea that plants "fight" for whatever they need against other plants (taller and perhaps faster growing etc) releasing chemicals. Obviously hard to prove and not even priority to consider when doing a planted tank but and interesting idea :) agree with cliff as usual but that walstad lady it's worth a read I think.

Sent from my HTC One mini using Tapatalk
It's a fascinating book, been though don't understand all the detail, I don't need too, so far it's given me a better insight into planted aquaria
Everyone one should readit
 
Everyone should read dosing salts and other tutoriald here on UKAPS :) then Clives comments and then perhaps Walstad :) yeah it's one of those not commercial aqua books.I like it too. Paid 40quit for it man. Good luck! P

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Everyone should read dosing salts and other tutoriald here on UKAPS :) then Clives comments and then perhaps Walstad :) yeah it's one of those not commercial aqua books.I like it too. Paid 40quit for it man. Good luck! P

Sent from my HTC One mini using Tapatalk
40...ouch...sorry to break the news to you but is under a tenner on kindle now
 
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