German Blue Ram Fry - What Should I Feed Them?

[Lindy]

Pm me your address

 

[NC10]

I know it's harsh, but I'd pretty much write this batch off. If some do survive you've done well and if they don't, then you know you've done everything you can.

I can tell you're worrying asking for special delivery and oxygen. It's still not going to be with you until Monday, first class will do that anyway.

Just keep doing what you're doing, but now you're set up with your cultures and fully prepared for next time.

Good luck anyway

 

[mark4785]

I know it's harsh, but I'd pretty much write this batch off. If some do survive you've done well and if they don't, then you know you've done everything you can.

I can tell you're worrying asking for special delivery and oxygen. It's still not going to be with you until Monday, first class will do that anyway.

Just keep doing what you're doing, but now you're set up with your cultures and fully prepared for next time.

Good luck anyway

Well I'm just feeding them as frequently as possible with Hikari but I'm not putting much in as its been mentioned that it pollutes the water. I am worrying and very frustrated purely because they are too small to observe. Even with a torch and magnifying glass, its impossible to know if they are eating!

If I do lose them at least it will save the frustration of re-homing them as 3 LFS within a 10-mile radius of me won't take them off of me as they've had trouble keeping GBR alive in Derbyshire's hard water.

 

[sciencefiction]

Well I'm just feeding them as frequently as possible with Hikari but I'm not putting much in as its been mentioned that it pollutes the water.

Sorry mark, what I meant is not to feed less, but to clean more and change the water at least once daily by 50%. To be honest, if one applies discus growing tactics to any fry, it's the best way to grow them, apart from the nature of the food which differs depending on fish species.

 

[mark4785]

Sorry mark, what I meant is not to feed less, but to clean more and change the water at least once daily by 50%. To be honest, if one applies discus growing tactics to any fry, it's the best way to grow them, apart from the nature of the food which differs depending on fish species.

Ok. I'll syphon the water 1-2 times tomorrow by 50-75%.

I've just gone to feed the adult GBR's (the parent's of the fry) and I've noticed that 50 or so eggs have been deposited and the male is fertilising them. I guess they are giving me a second attempt! Between them, the 2 females are depositing 50 or more eggs every 5 days. They've only done this since I started doing a 10% water change every 2 weeks as opposed to a 50% water change weekly.

 

[NC10]

How big is the fry tank and what filter do you have on it?

It doesn't really matter how often and how much you feed really, as long as you keep up with decent daily water changes, maybe even twice daily if you can and remove anything you think they're not going to eat. Obviously a very small tank is going to take less effort, it will also be a lot easier for the fry to find food too. Little and often anyway,

I can tell you're doing it for the love/joy anyway, so all good It's very frustrating knowing there's not much you can do, but hopefully you've learnt a lot since making this thread. Just keep reading, learning and keeping your cultures active ready for the next time.

They go for at least £5 each, so if all else fails, a pound each on eBay if you're desperate should soon see them gone anyway.

Edit: Sorry, started replying during the Brazil match What sciencefiction said

 

[mark4785]

How big is the fry tank and what filter do you have on it?

It doesn't really matter how often and how much you feed really, as long as you keep up with decent daily water changes, maybe even twice daily if you can and remove anything you think they're not going to eat. Obviously a very small tank is going to take less effort, it will also be a lot easier for the fry to find food too. Little and often anyway,

I can tell you're doing it for the love/joy anyway, so all good It's very frustrating knowing there's not much you can do, but hopefully you've learnt a lot since making this thread. Just keep reading, learning and keeping your cultures active ready for the next time.

They go for at least £5 each, so if all else fails, a pound each on eBay if you're desperate should soon see them gone anyway.

Edit: Sorry, started replying during the Brazil match Want sciencefiction said

I did one 30% w/c today and got all of the rotting liquifry out. I will do the same twice tomorrow.

I know they can be quite expensive fish. My LFS sells adult GBR's for £7.99 each!

The fry tank is a ClearSeal 20 litre aquarium and this is the filter that is in use which I've attached to an air pump. The filter media that came with it had been placed in a well established pond filter for about 10 days. I wasn't sure that this would be adequate so I snipped a 5-year old filter media portion out and added that to the fry filter.

 

[NC10]

Brilliant mate, you clearly know what you're doing then. The only thing I'd personally do different is establish the foam in your tropical tank. I don't know if bacteria from a pond would die off from going to warmer water, but I wouldn't want to risk introducing anything nasty from a pond.

Where in Derbyshire are you?

 

[mark4785]

Brilliant mate, you clearly know what you're doing then. The only thing I'd personally do different is establish the foam in your tropical tank. I don't know if bacteria from a pond would die off from going to warmer water, but I wouldn't want to risk introducing anything nasty from a pond.

Where in Derbyshire are you?

I'm from the Chesterfield area.[DOUBLEPOST=1404574887][/DOUBLEPOST]If somebody here had GBR fry, what would you feed them and how often would you do so?

Is there a stage of their growth where they will refuse any food?

And lastly, does anybody vaguely know how many fry inevitably die, if any?

 

[NC10]

Have you tried the mill garden centre? Or brook as it's now called. I've just been in and they have some rams.

I've asked them before as well about taking clownfish fry on and they said they would. Worth a try anyway if you haven't already.

 

[sciencefiction]

If somebody here had GBR fry, what would you feed them and how often would you do so?

You feed any fry as much as they can possibly take and you can manage by keeping the water quality perfect, providing all the essentials needed for them to develop. It's the most important stage of their growth when if certain stuff is missing or not enough it will impact their growth, well being, current/future health, appearance, size, survival, etc...I'd feed them with manufactured high protein fry dedicated food and some live food variety if you can get it. This way they'll get everything they need.

Is there a stage of their growth where they will refuse any food?
When they still have their yolk sac attached within the first 24-48 hrs after hatching. Fish refuse to eat when not feeling well generally for one or another reason. With fry it's critical to have them eating one way or another. The reason could be as small as the tank being too big and they can't find the food or the tank too small and water quality is tipping all the time.
But when they are too small it's hard seeing them eat to be honest. You should judge by the growth rate, if no growth, you have a problem. For example for me the same species of corys sometimes grew up incredibly fast when I was keeping them well, other spawns which I didn't keep as well grew up twice as slow and weren't as healthy, I had some losses but not major as I stepped up in time.

And lastly, does anybody vaguely know how many fry inevitably die, if any?
This would largely depend on many factors. Some may have a 100% survival rate, some 5%. User errors, inexperience and genetics come into play as well. See above example.

And sometimes regardless of how well you keep them, you will have runts no matter what. They won't be the most beautiful fish but they can be as healthy as any other. You decide which ones to use in breeding projects.

 

[mark4785]

Have you tried the mill garden centre? Or brook as it's now called. I've just been in and they have some rams.

I've asked them before as well about taking clownfish fry on and they said they would. Worth a try anyway if you haven't already.

I actually went to the Brook garden centre today and asked them if they'd take some of my fry in when they have grown up. They said they would take 10 at a time in. I only asked after having looked in their aquariums to see how healthy their fish are as I'm not taking them anywhere if they aren't cared for properly. Some of their tanks had dead corydoras in today and they had a holding tank outside with what looked like 4 dead shubunkins. The GBR's looked fine thankfully.

Thanks for the suggestion but I beat you to it! [DOUBLEPOST=1404581815][/DOUBLEPOST]

If somebody here had GBR fry, what would you feed them and how often would you do so?

You feed any fry as much as they can possibly take and you can manage by keeping the water quality perfect, providing all the essentials needed for them to develop. It's the most important stage of their growth when if certain stuff is missing or not enough it will impact their growth, well being, current/future health, appearance, size, survival, etc...I'd feed them with manufactured high protein fry dedicated food and some live food variety if you can get it. This way they'll get everything they need.

Is there a stage of their growth where they will refuse any food?
When they still have their yolk sac attached within the first 24-48 hrs after hatching. Fish refuse to eat when not feeling well generally for one or another reason. With fry it's critical to have them eating one way or another. The reason could be as small as the tank being too big and they can't find the food or the tank too small and water quality is tipping all the time.
But when they are too small it's hard seeing them eat to be honest. You should judge by the growth rate, if no growth, you have a problem. For example for me the same species of corys sometimes grew up incredibly fast when I was keeping them well, other spawns which I didn't keep as well grew up twice as slow and weren't as healthy, I had some losses but not major as I stepped up in time.

And lastly, does anybody vaguely know how many fry inevitably die, if any?
This would largely depend on many factors. Some may have a 100% survival rate, some 5%. User errors, inexperience and genetics come into play as well. See above example.

And sometimes regardless of how well you keep them, you will have runts no matter what. They won't be the most beautiful fish but they can be as healthy as any other. You decide which ones to use in breeding projects.

Thanks for your input. I personally think they are growing but I think this growth may have come from the fact that they received some nourishment from having consumed the yolk sac. At this stage, its as though they will only eat stuff thats right in front of them which makes me think that the tank should be full of artificial plants or other objects where the fry food will drop onto for them to eat. The fry food is currently sitting on the base of the aquarium where it's being ignored.

 

[sciencefiction]

they will only eat stuff thats right in front of them which makes me think that the tank should be full of artificial plants or other objects where the fry food will drop onto for them to eat. The fry food is currently sitting on the base of the aquarium where it's being ignored..

Yes, this tend to happen. Sometimes you've got to stick the food under their nose and they can be too skittish and swim away while doing so. Just shower them with fresh food, remove old food, do plenty of water changes and hope for the best

 

[Michael W]

Mark by any chance do you have substrate in the grow out tank? Having tried breeding Apistogrammas before I can tell you that having sand in the bottom of the grow out tank will benefit the fries as they grow up. The fry could eat from micro-organisms from the sand and it also gets the fry accustomed to sifting through the sand as they progress. Many breeders will place a small amount of sand to encourage this behaviour since they are Eartheaters. Have you also considered almond leaves too as a long term source of food for the smallest of fry?

Michael.

 

[mark4785]

Mark by any chance do you have substrate in the grow out tank? Having tried breeding Apistogrammas before I can tell you that having sand in the bottom of the grow out tank will benefit the fries as they grow up. The fry could eat from micro-organisms from the sand and it also gets the fry accustomed to sifting through the sand as they progress. Many breeders will place a small amount of sand to encourage this behaviour since they are Eartheaters. Have you also considered almond leaves too as a long term source of food for the smallest of fry?

Michael.

No, I left sand out thinking it would just trap detritus. I may try this but it will make water changes quite a headache as when I syphon the dirty water out I won't be able to place that water in the toilet due to the sand. Sand can cause problems if it gets into the drains I think.

I hadn't realised that almond leaves were a source of food for fry. How long could I place one into the water before it begins to cause water quality problems and how many would suffice for 20 litre fry tank?

Mark.[DOUBLEPOST=1404589910][/DOUBLEPOST]

Yes, this tend to happen. Sometimes you've got to stick the food under their nose and they can be too skittish and swim away while doing so. Just shower them with fresh food, remove old food, do plenty of water changes and hope for the best

I've mixed 8 drops of liquifry into a beaker and gently poured it in. This would have "showered" them. I've done a 50% W/C which removed the old food. About 80% of the fry are not visible so my hope is that they have gone into hiding in the artificial plant thats in there. Its quite a dense plant and it has a white base so theres no chance of me seeing them.

 

[Michael W]

Hi Mark,

I see your concern with sand and cleaning but its worth while although its not necessarily a must but it can help bring out the sifting/ scavenging side of the dwarf cichlids especially the earth eaters. You don't need a big layer of sand, if you don't mind discarding the dirty water in the garden for plants etc it can be worth a try.

Regarding the leaf litter I will just throw it in and leave it there in all honesty. Many keep leaf litters with expensive shrimps until they eat the whole leaf without problems. Here is a link to an article out lining the benefits of leaf litter such as almond leaves for the health of fish as well as decorative properties http://www.seriouslyfish.com/all-the-leaves-are-brown/

Michael.

 

[sciencefiction]

I hadn't realised that almond leaves were a source of food for fry. How long could I place one into the water before it begins to cause water quality problems and how many would suffice for 20 litre fry tank?

They will not cause water quality problems so put as often and as many as you like, you don't even have to remove them as they break down though that may not go down without brown particle dust. If your water is too soft they can have an effect on the Kh and cause the Ph to drop so in this case don't put too many at once. I can't remember but one leaf per 10G...someone else might be more clued to soft water.[DOUBLEPOST=1404590833][/DOUBLEPOST]I agree with Michael, a thin layer of sand is a good thing. Especially if fry are on the bottom as clear bottom develops bacteria that can harm fry if not wiped often.

 

[mark4785]

Hi Mark,

I see your concern with sand and cleaning but its worth while although its not necessarily a must but it can help bring out the sifting/ scavenging side of the dwarf cichlids especially the earth eaters. You don't need a big layer of sand, if you don't mind discarding the dirty water in the garden for plants etc it can be worth a try.

Regarding the leaf litter I will just throw it in and leave it there in all honesty. Many keep leaf litters with expensive shrimps until they eat the whole leaf without problems. Here is a link to an article out lining the benefits of leaf litter such as almond leaves for the health of fish as well as decorative properties http://www.seriouslyfish.com/all-the-leaves-are-brown/

Michael.

I will look for a bag of natural sand on the internet and add a very thin layer of it when it arrives. I will also look for the almond leaves that you've mentioned.

I do have a bag of catappa leaves. Are these just as useful? I've never bothered using them as I know they can drop the pH and KH very quickly causing crypt melt and who know's what for the fish.[DOUBLEPOST=1404597036][/DOUBLEPOST]Sorry, just realised that catappa leaves are in fact almond leaves!!

 

[mark4785]

Bad news everyone... I've tested the fry tank water for ammonia and the result was 0.5 ppm which explains why most of the fry are not visible.

 

[sciencefiction]

The joys of fry tanks....
Sorry about the little ones, it's still not too late to save the rest if water gets back to normal. It's probably the reason they don't eat. I personally use tetra baby min as powder food, it doesn't ruin the water like hikari or liquifry, although one still need to be cautious. I am sure I've read about better ones but I haven't tried them.

As for the almond leaves, with a water like mine with a kh of 8 it has absolutely no effect to the ph, the kh goes down to 4 maybe but I add tons of them at a time.