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Tips for growing moss (...really beautiful moss)

parotet

Member
Joined
12 Oct 2013
Messages
1,695
Location
Valencia, Spain
Hi all

Lately I have managed to grow moss in one of my tanks much better than I've done before. I'm happy with this and now I am seriously considering for future projects to use them more extensively, but honestly I'm still far away from this lush growing I can see in some brilliant aquascapes. There are 2 tanks from Viktor Lantos when I write this that come to my mind (and of course quite a lot from Amano) in which the combination of different moss species and other plants (for example Montecarlo, Cuba, etc.) add very interesting details and textures to the aquascapes.

As far as I've read there some key issues:

- co2 and light: they can grow without much of it, but C enriched tanks grow fabulous moss. With light it seems that they grow more compact and for some species it is nearly mandatory.
- temperature: it looks that moss do prefer cooler temperatures.
- nutrients: my guess is that their nutrient uptake must be quite low, but not sure
- attaching the moss: at the beginning I used to glue or attach with a cotton thread a small amount of moss on branches or stones, but I have realized later on that it is much better to attach a very thin layer of them, one 'leave' layer is more than enough to promote new growth and I have also realized that if they are all well aligned (sorry I can't find the word, I mean looking on the same direction) you get a nice shape sooner. I have also tried dried start, works great (mixer, moss and water... And then just paint).
- care and trimming: not too much information here... This is actually where I need more info. I'm a not sure if they need frequent hard trimming/renew or if they have to be trimmed 'leave by leave'. I also destroy the beautiful structure of i.e. Christmas moss 'leaves' when trying to lightly siphon the debris on it... But if I don't do this they take easily all the debris (fish poo, fish food, etc.). Any tip for cleaning without doing a mess?
Trimming is a PITA but there is a great video from George Farmer in which he explains how to attach a tube to the scissors.

(I assume there is a vast diversity of moss, from easy ones to very difficult... I'm not thinking about plain Java moss but medium to high demanding species that are also IMO more delicate in shape such as Christmas, weeping, Fissidens, etc.)

I have also in my low tank where I'm achieving a decent and beautiful growth some green thread algae... These nasty long green hairs. Really difficult to get rid of them, removing them physically is very difficult (and you easily destroy the structure, even if you use sticks to remove them or cut them) and water changes doesn't help very much. Once you done your best, well they they just grow again and again.

Hope the few tips I have compiled for the moment are useful for someone, but any new info will be welcome. Maybe it has been explained before in UKAPS but I haven't found it. Any good reading elsewhere would be much appreciated also.

Jordi
 
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I've just read all that and found no pictures jordi. I normally won't read more than a paragraph unless there's a picture :D
 
Hi everyone,

I've had very good experience of moss a few years back. My very first attempt had fail and I had put it down to tying the moss too loosely. So when I tried again like a month later, only tying the moss loosely, it worked much better! It eventually turned into this (I started with very few strands):

8228374794_48160bed7b.jpg


While it was not scaped with, I can say that it was very healthy. Noticed that the spray bar was facing into the moss, this leads me to believe that moss appreciate flow. I also had a lot of shrimp in there and I mean a lot.

While the moss was successful back then, I have failed to repeat its success and eventually it all died right back! Currently, I am able to keep some fissidens but the older mosses are starting to fade away, but there are some new growths here and there. However, they grow super slow.

I also have a rock with some anchor moss growing, a lot had died back but the remaining ones are growing. There are a few things that have changed with this tank over the years. I now use ferts in small amounts (I didn't use a single drop back then), I have soil substrate with cat litter, changed filter, it has no spray bar and the flow does not directly hit the moss but they do receive flow, less shrimps (around 8, had over 100).

I'm not sure if I can make any definite conclusions but I believe the flow and shrimps were key to its success. The flow provided a strong current which may have helped to deliver what little nutrients and CO2 was present in the tank, both of which I did not add. The shrimps helped to clean the moss from possible debris trapped in the moss as a result of the flow. The new setup provides more flow in general but not directly at the moss, my shrimp population was down to single digits due to a house guest spraying perfume pretty much next to tanks in the room, leaving me with just female shrimps. So there are no shrimps cleaning the mosses now. I however, do not notice any visible debris in both setups but it is generally agreed that there will be debris trapped in moss.

I'm looking forward to see some of the tips others can give as I do want to moss successfully once again.

Michael.
 
Those are really lovely displaces of what mosses can achieve. I think in order to get them to looking so compact is to choose the right mosses coupled with heavy trimming to encourage more lateral growth before allow them to grow upwards.

Mosses like java moss can grow compact by trimming but I left mine to its own accord. Yet even after trimming they won't be as compact as some other mosses, so it really depends which ones you are working with.
 
Lol... yep, it also happens to me. No pictures = bit boring.

Jordi
my grammar is poor that's why I put pictures to explain myself:D enjoyed the read by the way. Those moss tanks are awsome
 
What about maintenance? I has been mentioned that shrimp and flow can help to get rid of the debris, but do you lightly siphon the moss? Any tip? Sometimes I use a bamboo stick to shake a little bit the moss and then suck what is floating around.

And what about ferts?

Jordi
 
I never siphoned my moss in the setup above but I do that currently and I do believe it helps has my shrimp numbers have fell. I also never put ferts in my tank up until recently too and I do not believe it is needed in my setup above.
 
Hi in my first attempt I tried to tie a thick layer of weeping moss on driftwood. By the time the cotton thread decayed the moss did not attach to the wood (about 1.5 month)
I understood my mistake and tied a much thinner layer of moss on driftwood, again using cotton thread. I can see fresh tips everywhere but I am worried if cotton thread will decay before the moss anchors to driftwood. Should I use a thin fishing line instead?

11ict2t.jpg
 
Fissidens fontanus is really not that difficult to grow.......
- it does very well for both ground-carpeting and moss-walls. On both cases it is very advantagous to tie strings tightly onto mesh. This way the whole thing can be gently removed from tank - put in water in some holder - and trimmed there. This mean no contamination of the rest of the tank.
 
To be honest, most of the "aquatic" mosses tend to "go lazy" under water, meaning they really don't attach well. Fissidens and Java are quite sure to attach, given time.
 
To have the best mosses out there we usually go with the following stuff:

- Lots of light (many mosses looks awesome if you shoot with more). They will be bushy. Of course you need to stay on the top of your things to avoid algae. Riccardia is a light lover for sure.
- Soft water like all other plants mosses love these too. Fissidens above is one of them. This does not mean it not grow in harder water, but surely in soft it is a different story :)
- Keep it cold. Below 25 celsius. Some mosses tolerate the warmer waters, but if we talk about the best looking then go with soft
- Fertilizers additionally to our daily fertilizer routine i've seen many example when mosses really love the additional phosphate. It does not matter if this was EI or lean ferts. But better to measure. If you do not see difference, like more active pearling within a day then it's not required.
- CO2
- We use good filters otherwise all the floating mess would be collected by your mosses. Will have less this way.

- For maintenance the more shrimps the better. Tropica has a great guide on this how much is the ideal. 1 amano shrimp per 5 liters http://tropica.com/en/guide/algal-control/
- Siamese algae eater the one which does not eat your moss :)
- Additional stuff might can help call it snake oil whatever. For us Twinstar is a bless for mosses.

- Since almost all mosses hate H2O2 or Carbo you had to do maintenances manually. Brushes, siphon, trimming sometimes.

Also no matter what super healthy moss you receive it does not mean it will stay in this beauty form. This was in the earlier place but when you drop in and your tank parameters are different, the moss will transform quickly.

Some crazy examples:

Riccardia eat up my friend's scape :)

16127270051_d57acba9e7_b.jpgSierra by DanielSzente, on Flickr

Riccardia also agressively eat up the scape here :)

15158216169_92e8d826e0_b.jpgGreen Aqua Showroom by viktorlantos, on Flickr

We put like 30 box of java moss to this tree :)

15984419132_859cd0f812_b.jpgGreen Aqua Showroom by viktorlantos, on Flickr

The tank you linked earlier also had many beautiful mosses. We shoot it with 4x54 or 6x54W (ATI Sunpower)

14878408217_5e9fc6be43_b.jpgGreen Aqua Showroom by viktorlantos, on Flickr

Flame on the top of the rocks. However this one is not that sensitive to light

14917844960_16a6625cb3_b.jpgTalachi team - The Rupture IAPLC 2014 rank 122 by viktorlantos, on Flickr

13046652363_d6337c4598_b.jpgRiccardia chamedryfolia by viktorlantos, on Flickr

12225136145_fe4f396ef3_b.jpgAquatic Plants by viktorlantos, on Flickr

12225728496_8b6da1b7e8_b.jpgAquatic Plants by viktorlantos, on Flickr

And 2 moss loveliness from the ADA Gallery 2013

11457798963_3c71047d2d_b.jpgADA Nature Aquarium Gallery by viktorlantos, on Flickr

11457628805_417c009524_b.jpgADA Nature Aquarium Gallery by viktorlantos, on Flickr

I am sure many has their own recipe for success, but the above ones works for us in the past few years and since you linked in one of our tanks i thought you might be interested how we do this.
 
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That's awesome Victor. I'm not in the same league, but I've had a fair old amount of success with Tulgey Wood. Both Fissidens and Taxiphyllum barbieri grow like mad and I've even managed to coax Riccardia chamedryfolia in to growing...slowly but steadily.
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7528/16047542046_3ba66fa476_b.jpg
I think the secret is healthy neglect.
 
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So how best to attach to bits of wood Viktor?

I plan to use moss on some lava rock, and am thinking of using netting over the moss pieces so that the moss sticks to the rock. Any suggestions/tricks please?

If this is a fresh start tank and you plan to use bits of mosses then dry start is a great way for wood. Just check George Farmer's earlier journal on this. Awesome yoghurt story over there :)
On lava this is not working the same unfortunately.

My last tank is a dry start one. I used a repti fogger and created like 100% humidity for mosses for 3 weeks or so. On wood this looks good, but on the lava rocks all disappeared. When i dropped in 10 otocinclus they eat up all my moss on the stones for the next day :eek:. It may had algae or they just switched to joghurt for a taste :)

Some photo from the start:

15276788856_a39e8d55a7_b.jpgMoss planting with dry start by viktorlantos, on Flickr

15113125060_124b4a83ac_b.jpgMoss planting with dry start by viktorlantos, on Flickr

And the fogger. I figured out i do not have that much time to spray the mosses along the day and 4x54W dryed up the plants quickly. The fogger solved my problem and put this baby to autopilot mode :)

15156952500_77449056c8_b.jpgMoss growing - with auto humidifier by viktorlantos, on Flickr

The tank is 2 months old now still working on it

16140191915_de0705db48_b.jpgHome project - 223L by viktorlantos, on Flickr



It has like 5-6 mosses again. Riccardia, Fissidens, Spiky, Taiwan, Creeping.... and i throwed out Amblystegium Serpens as this looked well on dry start but messed up the tank later and caused many trouble.

For lava i would go with super glue (gel one) even if your tank is not a fresh starter you can use small bits in water. Not harmful for shrimp and other sensitive species. But of course better to work with on fresh start.
But net, fishing line or riccia line could work too.

Riccardia, Fissidens and Java moss attach to decors. Christmas, Spiky, Weeping, Willow and some others not.
 
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