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Open Book

RossMartin

Member
Joined
2 Nov 2007
Messages
358
Location
Hemel Hempstead
Open Book

I didn't know it was so hard to choose a title for a fish tank. I've called mine Open Book as i am learning how to do everything. I've played with planted tanks for a while but never done one seriously. I know the layout leaves a lot to be desired but i was keen to get some moss on some wood and try to make a lot of areas for the fish to swim trough and around.

Setup Date: 03/11/2015
Tank: TMC 600 60x45x30
Light: 1 x TMC 1500Ultima at 25% for 6 hours no ramp
Filtration: JBL CristalProfi e1500, with Acrylic Spraybar and glass intake
Hardscape: Manzita Wood andMini Landscaping rock
Substrate: Complete ADA Amazonia powder with Power Sand. Aquarium sand and stones
CO2: 2Kg fire Extinguisher though a ceramic disc diffuser. I'm unable to count the bubbles in the bubble counter. I also add a double dosage of EasyCarbo each day as well
Water: 100% RO water (I intend to reminearilise so i can keep shrimp once i have finished with the water changes because of the ammonia spike with the ADA)
Fertilization: EI
Plants:
- TROPICA 1-2-GROW STAUROGYNE REPENS
- TROPICA 1-2-GROW HEMIANTHUS CUBA
- ELEOCHARIS PARVULA
- POGOSTEMON HELFERI
- CRYPTOCORYNE BALANSAE
- LUDWIGIA PAULUSTRIS
- LILAEOPSIS BRASILIENSIS
- FISSIDENS FONTANUS

Photo:
FTS_16.jpg


The originally had the tank setup using a tropica substrate but the plants kept lifting so i replaced it with some ADA Amazonia and Power Sand i hadn't used and left in the garage. As I am using Amazonia i have been doing 50% daily water changes because of the Ammonia spike. I am now going to do this every other day for the next week and the into a 50% weekly water change.

Some of the plants were plants i had from another tanks but i am keen to get an HC carpet going. Some of the new Repens and Helferi looks like it is melting and i think the HC is starting to go too.

Melt1_16.jpg


Melt2_16.jpg



I have an Acrylic spray bar across the back of the tank on my JBL e1500 and you can visibly see the plants moving:
Spray Bar_16.jpg


CO2 information for today so far is below. I did do my water change at twelve today hence the temperature spike and PH drop you can see the actual webpage and current stats here: http://pi.aquapi.co.uk/:

monitor_16.jpg

Any advise on how i can prevent the melt would be great. My drop checker is green and my PH probe is calibrated correctly.

Also any comments on the layout would be greatly appreciated as i seem to get mental blocks when it comes to the hardscape!

Kind Regards

Ross
 
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The layout looks great. Im new to aquascaping.
In terms of advice, dark substrate would make the scape stand out. I was drawn to the light at the back of the aquarium and the sand.

The planting looks great and interesting though.
 
Hi Derek,

Thanks for the feedback. I did have Black Tropica substrate in but the plants kept lifting. The plan is that the ADA Amazonia won't be visible once the carpeting plants have spread...if they stop melting!

I really like corys, hence the sand area!

Thanks

Ross
 
I suspect poor CO2 due to you being misled by "tech" and ignoring what the plants are saying. I assume you have demineralised your RO as most pH probes wont work or give meaningful readings if dKH is low, usually below 4dKH.

Or could be plants just settling in in their new environment. Just keep light under control to allow them to settle in new growth should readily appear.

As you have no fish ,you can turn the CO2 way up so that drop checker is yellow where ever it is located in the tank.

I assume the filter @ 1400l/hr is x10 the tank volume , ie tank volume below 140litres to guarantee adequate flow and CO2 distribution.
 
Hi Ian,

Thanks for the reply. CO2 was my suspicion. What I have done is have the tank setup using good old London tap water and then changed the water out to RO. I know I was getting a PH drop of over 1 point before lights on with tap water.

I have got Seachem Equilibrium to remineralise it but I also have Shrimplab Caridina to use as well. I wanted to use RO water, however am thinking I would be best to cut it with tap water now.

So do you think that I would be better of cutting the RO with tap water and increasing the GH and KH. This should then allow me to accurately measure the CO2 in the water?

The tank is 80 litres so the filter should be more than adequate. I have put pot scrubbers in the filter as to improve the flow.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
Yes cut the water 50:50 should get you reliable pH readings.

Also try pH readings in different parts of the tank and with all electrics off and unplugged in case you are having electrical interfere issues. Some people have reported pH differences of 0.5 to 1.0 at different ends of the tank due to electrical interference.

Also take a cup of water out of tank at your pH minimum and leave 24hours (or shake vigorously) to degas CO2 then remeasure pH to see if it has dropped one unit pH.
 
Hi Ian,

I've just done a water change and replaced half the water with decolorisation tap water I did a little bit over 50% to allow for the water in the filter.

I'll let that all settle down and take some readings tomorrow. I'll add another drop checker and put this close to the substrate where the melt was!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
That's a nice scape. Too bad the plants are melting.
I have the same light unit as you, but mine is all the way up to 100% as i have the taller 60x45x45 cm TMC tank and the unit is hanging about 30 cm above the tank.
But i am dosing crazy amounts of co2 though, its always more into the yellow than green.
Keep fish and shrimp but they seem unaffected,in fact my red cherrys can't stop breeding.
I am being overrun with shrimp.
And i am using the good old london tap water.
I am not sure if melting would be down to poor co2, usually i get algae with poor co2.
Melting could be more something like not enough light or change a in water chemistry.
Which in your case would have happened when you moved into RO water.
But i am no expert so don't take it from me.
 
I did think the change was also a contribution. Maybe they are adjusting. I have reduced the lighting to 15% just in case there is a co2 issue. It did cross my mind about not enough light as I have no algae issues at alI which I didn't think is right as all the tanks in the featured journals have minor algae issues!!!! I must be doing something fundamentally wrong, hopefully with the help of you guys I will find it!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
I did think the change was also a contribution. Maybe they are adjusting. I have reduced the lighting to 15% just in case there is a co2 issue. It did cross my mind about not enough light as I have no algae issues at alI which I didn't think is right as all the tanks in the featured journals have minor algae issues!!!! I must be doing something fundamentally wrong, hopefully with the help of you guys I will find it!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Like i said i run mine at 100% but when i researched the unit here they all replied they were not using anywhere near that.
But even so 15% seems pretty low to me. Maybe someone using the same unit and tank as you can help.
 
Hi All,

So i took some reading of the water today.

Tap water:
PH: 7.6
TDS: 336
KH: 16
GH: 19

Tank Water:
PH: 7.0
TDS: 226
KH: 7

At Lights on the PH had dropped 0.5 of a point. Looking at the charts this PH/KH/CO2 charts this is about right.....assuming i am looking reading it correctly.

This is a photo of the tank with the drop checkers three hours after the lights turned on. You can see i added a drop checker about an inch above where the melt was. Both drop checkers were yellow.

Tank and Checkers_16.jpg


This is a picture of the drop checkers 45 minutes after the CO2 went off, not the best photo..and to add i am colour blind, although my better half assures me they are both yellow:

Drop Checkers_16.jpg
 
To me they are both yellow.
As for the rest of the values i'll be honest i never test for anything in my tanks.
Can't be bothered anymore.
Used to do it back in the day but today i just look at the plants,do some tweaks,watch them again and readjust depending on how they are doing.
I am not an expert though, just outgrew the need to be testing all the values, either that or i took EI's philosophy of no testing to serious.
What am i saying..
I am just a lazy blahblahblahblahblahblahblah...

P.S tank does look good though.
 
I never tested, but i thought for £10 i get a rough idea of the KH so i can use the PH/CO2/KH charts to see what i should be aiming for! It was also an excuse to go and look at the LFS and get out of doing the hoovering!
 
I never tested, but i thought for £10 i get a rough idea of the KH so i can use the PH/CO2/KH charts to see what i should be aiming for! It was also an excuse to go and look at the LFS and get out of doing the hoovering!
I use my fish to tell me when its enough i guess. Probably not the best method.
I have the drop checker to give me an idea, but i aim to always have as much co2 in there as possible without affecting my fish and shrimp.
I have both my tanks going well into the yellow but both my fish and shrimp seem unaffected and the shrimp keep breeding consistently.
For me that's enough to say i am not dosing too much.
I also try to maximize flow as much as possible so i have my filter outlet and extra wavemaker positioned in areas where i noticed flow was not so good.
The problem with the dropchecker is that it's not giving you how much co2 have in the water at that exact time. There's a significant delay that makes it hard to actually notice variations.
 
Hi all,
What I have done is have the tank setup using good old London tap water and then changed the water out to RO.
Your active substrate will have picked up a some calcium (Ca++) ions from the tap water (it will have exchanged them for less strongly bound cations like NH4+, K+, H+ etc ). There may also be anion exchange effects with HCO3-

This may mean that the dGH and pH will continually creep up.

The first time I used cat litter I washed it in our very hard tap water to get rid of the smell (didn't work), but I found subsequently that it took a long time (~6 months), changing the water with rain-water, to get the hardness and pH back down.

The next time I used cat litter I just put it in a bucket of rain-water and left it in the garden for the winter. It still smelt at the end of this, but it didn't alter the pH.

cheers Darrel
 
Thank Darrel,

I don't pretend to understand the scientific element to be honest, i never took to chemistry. Strange really as my dad as a degree in it!

Is this likely to cause me issues, in particular melting plants? Also i am now using 50% RO and 50% tap water now as well so i can get accurate results when measuring the PH. I'm more than happy to keep using it!

At the moment i only want put fish in. Ottos, Panda Corys and either Celestial Pearl Danios (or what ever they are called this month!) or cardinal tetras. I'm happy to wait to put shrimp in.

Many thanks for you input.

Ross
 
Melting is usually down to poor co2 distribution. I'd keep your lights down at the 15% (maybe even lower it), which will slow the plants metabolism. Watch your plants and see how they respond, your TMC tile is a very powerful fixture and most people suspend these 30-40cm above the tank.

Regards,
James
 
Hi James,

Ironically i was thinking about turning the lights down when you posted. The melt is in the centre of the tank where i imagine the light it at its most intense. I have turned both channels down to 7% and will monitor for the next few days. I had an UP lnline atomizer that developed a fault. I'm waiting for the replacement to come from CO2art. It should be here in the next few days. I'll put this on so i can examine where the bubbles go. I really don't like the look of the bubbles but i'll use it so i can see the flow. Once i know i can always go back to the diffuser on the outlet of the filter, or i could put the atmoizer on the inlet as i have a spare ceramic tube so can clean it out often and easily.

Thanks

Ross
 
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Hi all,
I don't pretend to understand the scientific element to be honest............Is this likely to cause me issues, in particular melting plants? Also i am now using 50% RO and 50% tap water now as well so i can get accurate results when measuring the PH. I'm more than happy to keep using it!

At the moment i only want put fish in. Ottos, Panda Corys and either Celestial Pearl Danios (or what ever they are called this month!) or cardinal tetras. I'm happy to wait to put shrimp in.
No it shouldn't prove a problem. Cardinal Tetra are happier in softer water, but they survive in harder water. For most plants it doesn't make any difference.

As a general rule tanks with some dGH/dKH are easier to look after than ones with very soft water.

If you want to breed fish that need soft water or keep Crystal Red Shrimp etc. you need to keep an "active substrate" away from hard water

cheers Darrel.
 
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