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Inert substrate and EI Dosing

Ovidiu

Ovidiu

Member
Joined
15 Jun 2015
Messages
57
Hello,

Can anyone confirm that you can grow any type of plants using inert substrate and normal Ei Dosing? Im talking about the root feeders like Echinodorus and Cuba for example.
The only argument i could find when using enriched substrate like Amazonia is that it helps with nutrients in case you forget to dose couple of days and lowers the Ph levels.
I've seen amazing plants grown with inert substrate and i would like to give it a try.

Am i missing something on this subject?
 
This is exactly what i needed to know. As long as one uses EI dosing the need for enriched substrate is optional. This should be found in the bible aswell lol . I always thought that using enriched substrate with Ei dosing is overkill but i never got a confirmation on this.

Thanks a lot for the fast response and the link aswell.
 
I experience some plants which prefer or mayby rather say demand something comfortable around it's roots benefit from something extra.. Crypts for example, can be grown on sand, but definitely do better with when some roottabs are added also echinodorus likes rootfeeding very much and will grow more robust and faster. Blyxa same story..

If you know on forehand where you plant what, you can still use inert substrate but just put some extra in those places where you plant. For example crypts do better in light acidic soils with iron. Since they are prone to melt and depend on it's rhizome and roots to start up again the defenitely benefit from a bit more then inert substrate only and water column ferts.

I used akadama and fuji sand caped with gravel in one of my tanks, this contains zip from the bag. But added some laterite clay balls and peat in the substrate where i planted the crypts. Laterite is very rich in iron and peat makes the substrate a bit more acidic.. JBL Tormec is ideal, it comes in pellets, just break it into pieces in prefered size and put them like a fert tab in the substrate at the plants roots. In a few hours they become soft and fall apart. :) Also very easy to add when tank already is flooded.

You can also make you own clay tabs with ore withoutt laterite with added ferts and peat already in it. I've seen them even for sale, but i guess as home made product from the LFS.
 
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Can i consider having a classic jungle aquascape using inert substrate and Ei dosing? This is the next project i want to start and now i feel i wont get the results i want without fertilized substrate.
 
Look at this fellow, i know him personaly, i buy of his plants sometimes and visited his home a few times and seen this tank in person. Just look at the pics it say enough. :) Note it is High Tech your looking at.. He has about 6 more tanks setup simularly.. He's growing all this on plain white quartz sand and using EI and root tabs.. :thumbup:
http://www.flowgrow.de/aquarienvorstellungen/864l-aquarium-mit-ein-paar-pflanzen-t37553.html

So yes we can, if we know what we are doing ofcourse.

I believe even low tech it is possible with the right plant choice and a few years of patience.. Initialy the substrate is inert, but this wont stay like that, obviously it eventualy can/will mature into a rather rich mass with organics braking down into etc. :)
 
Ovidiu said:
Can i consider having a classic jungle aquascape using inert substrate and Ei dosing? This is the next project i want to start and now i feel i wont get the results i want without fertilized substrate.
Click to expand...
With easyish plants you will definetly have a jungle with gravel
20160115_233327.jpg
 

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Agree with zozo. I've grown echinodorus and crypts in inert gravel and sand with only water column dosing (EI) and they do well.

When I started adding in some root tabs underneath they grew even better, despite having plenty of nutrients in the water column.

Using aquasoil there is again an improvement, mainly due to the substrate being more suitable for heavy root feeders to develop healthy root systems. Once the nutrients in the aquasoil are expended, I add some root tabs every 6 months or so. This is about as perfect as I get the environment for them and I see best growth this way.

So.. EI and inert will grow them well. EI and inert and root tabs better again. EI and aquasoil and root tabs is about as good as you can do.
 
Hi there,

Many people confuse the role of the premium substrates, reason why they are overestimated, in some cases, and underestimated, in others.

It is fully true that you can grow practically any plant in plain gravel if you have dosage of ferts in column. The reason is pretty obvious: Plants are not taking nutrients from a solid state but dissolved into water, whenever this absorption happens at root level or leaf level.

The reason to use them is not associated to that. The role of the premium substrates, however, is to provide stability to the tank through their CEC properties. CEC or Cation Exchange Capability is something most gravels do have in very low values (apart from some provided by Seachem, so far I am aware of). The advantage of a high CEC is that works as a storage of ions (mainly cations, that is why the name) with a high mobility, i.e. easier for the plants to use. The factors determining such mobility are the relative concentration of the ions between soil and water, and the pH.

For instance, ions being commonly stored into a soil with a high CEC are potassium, ammonium, calcium, magnessium, iron, copper, aluminium, zinc, rubidium, chlorine and even phosphates, but at much less level than others. When these ions are at high concentration in water, vacancies into the electrostatic positions of the soil are filled with them, usually involving exchange of protons by cations. When these concentrations go down in water, the soil release these ions to the interstitial water, making them available for plants and filling the vacancies with protons (for cations). Additionally, a few premium sols include humic acids, which have a very high CEC but they are also very mobile in water, and they significantly improve the transference of ions between soil and roots.

So, essentially, premium soils act as a buffer of certain nutrients, regulating their concentration into the aquarium, and hence, giving stability. They also cover for any temporal unadvertised deficiency of these elements. This does not mean that you need them to be successful with plants, but it means, for example, that you have less chances of misteps, reason why they can be a difference between success or failure. Obviously, dedicated aquascapers or green fingers do not have such a problem, as controlled fertilizing plan fix the issue. But in general terms, it just makes easier the task. That is why they are so popular nowadays. It is not just a marketing thing.

Cheers,

Manuel
 
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