Product Review Seneye Reef - My experience so far...

[kadoxu]

So, I got a Seneye Reef last week and would like to comment on my experience with it so far.

I read a lot of posts regarding the device, some were good, others really bad... Here are a few pointers to sum up what I was able to find out before I got the device:

• Seneye PH meter is no good in softwater
• PH range measured was somewhere between 6 an 9
• PAR & LUX readings were something almost everyone was happy about
• It doesn't work as advertised if it's not attached to a PC with internet connection or to a Seneye Web Server.
• You have to replace the device's slide in order to keep getting text & email alerts.
• Seneye's software is only available for Windows.
• There was no way of exporting the gathered data (i.e. to Excel)

I've had mine running for a week now, and I am happy about some things and a bit disappointed about others.

I'll start with the bad news:

• PAR/LUX readings

A great feature... REALLY hard to use if, like me, you have something close to a closed top. You need to keep it steady and in a specific position for it to take measurements properly. Basically you need to hold it in position with one hand and use your PC's mouse with the other if you want to capture the data properly. So imagine having one hand steady on the bottom of your tank and use the other hand somehow to control your PC.

• Text & emails alerts

You have to replace the slide every month to get text & email alerts when one of the parameters goes out of the defined thresholds. So far so good, but the thing is, it can take a while for the data to reach Seneye's Cloud and for you to get an alert. An example - Yesterday, I wanted to test the "out of water" alert and had the device connected to my PC. I did a 50% water change and it took me a bit less than 30 min from the moment the device was completely out of water until it was submerged again. Let's say it was at least 20 min, just to be nice... and the number of alerts I got was (drumroll)... 0!

• Android App

After getting my device I realised there was an Android app for this... well it's a bit disappointing, to say the least, as it only shows the latest data sent to Seneye's Cloud and provides you a link to the web client...

• Suction Cup

The suction cup it's pretty useless if there is some kind of tension on the device's wire. Fortunately I contacted Seneye who promptly asked for my address to send a replacement. Let's see if I was just unlucky with mine.


Now, let's go for the good stuff:

• PH, Free Ammonia & other parameters

There are a few parameters that get measured by the device, making life a bit easier. Temperature, PH, Dissolved oxygen potential, Free Ammonia (NH3), Ammonium(NH4), PAR, LUX, and Kelvin.
I have medium/hard water and the PH readings have been quite accurate so far (at least when comparing to my test kit). NH3 & NH4 measurements seem ok as well. Be careful with Dissolved O2 Potential though, Seneye says 'This not directly measured, but is calculated, using an industry standard formula, from the other parameters that are directly taken'.

• PAR/LUX measurements

No, I'm not crazy... although it's hard to use, this feature is very useful if you have doubts about your light levels.

• Internal Storage

Don't want or can't leave the device connected your PC? You can always connect it to a USB charger and it will take and save measurements internally for up to 30 days. No alerts, though...
If, like me, there's nothing you can do even if you get an alert in the middle of a working day, this is not so bad. I just connect it to the PC once I get home and the all the recorded data gets transferred to Seneye's Cloud.

• Exporting data

So, you can actually export data to an Excel spreadsheet... with a catch... you have to email Seneye Support with the date range you want and they will send it to you.


Not bad for 7 days of usage... I'll update this whenever I have something more to add...

 

[MrHidley]

I have one of these, they are going to release specific slides for soft water in the future. I had the same problem with the suction cups, similarly to you I dropped them an email and they sent some replacements which were much better. I bought it mainly to use during cycling and for the PAR measurements, i don't think the readings are that accurate, but they do give me some ball park indication, which is very useful.

 

[kadoxu]

So, this week I had a bit of a problem with my device.

The ammonia readings in the Seneye Connect application didn't match the readings displayed on the website. After exchanging a few emails with Seneye support, trying to explain the issue and sending some screenshots, they told me this was a known bug in the software and offered me the possibility to become a beta tester for the new software version.

As a beta tester I can't say much about it, just that it's a bit better than the old one! lol

 

[Manuel Arias]

Hi kadoxu,

Thanks for this report. A few questions/comments, as I feel a bit curious about this device.

I have medium/hard water and the PH readings have been quite accurate so far (at least when comparing to my test kit).

I wonder... does the device includes any calibration routine or are the probe all time under water? pH meters work in a very specific way which demands regular immersion inside a KCl solution plus also periodic calibrations. Most problems with pH meters are derived from lack of maintenance as well as not considering electrostatic interactions....

NH3 & NH4 measurements seem ok as well.

And probably will have similar accuracy, being honest. Ammonia/ammonium probes are bloody expensive ($300-500 each) if you wish to do some good job with them, but that would put the price of the device out of potential market, so they need to be cheaper, and then, worse. Regardless, it would be enough with taking just the amount of ammonia, as ammonium concentration depends only from pH for a given concentration of ammonia, and the relationship is well known, thing that they probably are doing, even if they do not mention it...

PAR, LUX

Similar thing and probably one extracted from the other. More likely PAR is extracted from LUX value, really. There are some equations around linking one to the other, if you make some fair assumptions.

Be careful with Dissolved O2 Potential though, Seneye says 'This not directly measured, but is calculated, using an industry standard formula, from the other parameters that are directly taken'.

Well, yeah....essentially they have taken pH and temperature...

The ammonia readings in the Seneye Connect application didn't match the readings displayed on the website. After exchanging a few emails with Seneye support, trying to explain the issue and sending some screenshots, they told me this was a known bug in the software and offered me the possibility to become a beta tester for the new software version.

I love this one. So there is a bug in the software known by the company, which is not informed to users in advance until you notice the problem, you complain, and Seneye solution is to become you in a beta-software tester. Brilliant, really. They should give a pay raise to the technical support guys.

Being honest, I do not know the price of the thing and I do not deny its usage are usefulness but... I think they tried to do something very complex in a relative cheap device (considering prices of lab probes I mean) and outcome seems to be related to that. Just my impression, of course. I am glad that some people is happy with it, but I feel some smoke flowing out of the device...

Cheers,
Manuel

 

[kadoxu]

I wonder... does the device includes any calibration routine or are the probe all time under water? pH meters work in a very specific way which demands regular immersion inside a KCl solution plus also periodic calibrations. Most problems with pH meters are derived from lack of maintenance as well as not considering electrostatic interactions....

The device is kept under water at all times and has a disposable slide. You actually need to soak the slide for at least 24 hours before getting accurate readings. Seneye says it should be replaced every month, but I've seen people using it for a couple of months with the same results.
The slide contains 2 small colored pads, which I believe change colors the same way a testing strip would and are somehow measured by the device.

Similar thing and probably one extracted from the other. More likely PAR is extracted from LUX value, really. There are some equations around linking one to the other, if you make some fair assumptions.

I just wanted to have an idea about light levels in the tank... so it does the job for me.

And probably will have similar accuracy, being honest. Ammonia/ammonium probes are bloody expensive ($300-500 each) if you wish to do some good job with them, but that would put the price of the device out of potential market, so they need to be cheaper, and then, worse. Regardless, it would be enough with taking just the amount of ammonia, as ammonium concentration depends only from pH for a given concentration of ammonia, and the relationship is well known, thing that they probably are doing, even if they do not mention it...

I now think that NH4 is calculated rather than measured and only NH3 gets measured by the device.

I love this one. So there is a bug in the software known by the company, which is not informed to users in advance until you notice the problem, you complain, and Seneye solution is to become you in a beta-software tester. Brilliant, really. They should give a pay raise to the technical support guys.

As a software developer I do understand this... The software can be affected by the hardware drivers and whatever Windows version you are running, so I believe that this can be an issue to a low percentage of users and not to all of them. When you have a completely new version on the way it doesn't really make sense to upgrade the old one...

Being honest, I do not know the price of the thing and I do not deny its usage are usefulness but... I think they tried to do something very complex in a relative cheap device (considering prices of lab probes I mean) and outcome seems to be related to that. Just my impression, of course. I am glad that some people is happy with it, but I feel some smoke flowing out of the device...

I got the device for about £90 I think... and I agree with you here, but I'm actually happy with it, as it helps me as a beginner to see hourly changes on at least 3 important parameters (temp, PH, and NH3) and what changes when I do something in the tank without having to do a full set of water tests.

 

[kadoxu]

I would also like to put my hands on a MindStream device... but that one will be a bit more expensive... and a bit too big for my nano...

 

[kadoxu]

A bit more than a month since I started using the device. There is one update regarding the slides. I tried leaving the slide after it expired and after a few days it wouldn't take any more PH and NH4 readings. I don't know if this was updated with the beta firmware of the device or if I was completely wrong about using slides for longer than one month.

Temperature and the PAR/LUX sensor would still work.

So this means that you really need to use a slide per month, unless you want a Temperature probe that costs around £100...

I also had to reconfigure the temperature readings because they were off to almost less 1ºC when comparing wih my 2 other cheap temp probes.

I'm still very happy with it though.

 

[rebel]

Wow Seneye has some nerve releasing this type of half baked device with buggy software and useless suction cups. I'd rather these issues get ironed out before taking our money.

In the future, when anyone mentions Seneye I will think of half baked products and pain I would experience when I have one hand near the tanks sub and the other hand on my neighbour's PC because I have a Mac.

OP, great review man! Well done.

 

[kadoxu]

Wow Seneye has some nerve releasing this type of half baked device with buggy software and useless suction cups. I'd rather these issues get ironed out before taking our money.

In the future, when anyone mentions Seneye I will think of half baked products and pain I would experience when I have one hand near the tanks sub and the other hand on my neighbour's PC because I have a Mac.

OP, great review man! Well done.

Thank you!

In the end, I still believe it's an excellent thing to have when you're starting a new tank or stocking one.

 

[rebel]

It depends. I'll be honest but I'd rather buy a better filter or co2 reg/solenoid with this money.

If it's a good par meter, then this view may change but only if I become Mr Fantastic so that I can stretch.

For a fairly technical minded beginner this could be fine but it could easily confuse an absolute beginner.

I am glad that you are happy with it. I think it will come in handy for you to adjust lights when starting your next tank. I wouldn't put too much emphasis on those other readings. You can instant cycle your next tank anyway.