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Pogestomon Helperi

PBM3000

Member
Joined
19 Jul 2017
Messages
275
Location
Hampshire
See what I did, there? :D

I’ve grown P.H. successfully for some time now in my ‘medium tech’ but now that a ‘bed’ of them has established things are starting to go horribly wrong. Both upper and lower leaves are melting on different plants and they’re looking ragged.

Tank: 240l
Sub: Quartz gravel (established 1 year)
Temp: 24-25C
Light: Fluval F&P 2.0 @ 75% over 7.5hrs.
Ferts: EI dosing @ 25ml daily
CO2: Liquid @ 8ml daily

Any ideas?

38B8BB0E-C734-4383-8399-DEABB558016F.jpeg
 
If your EI mix is as per the APFUK or the mix Ceg mentions in his article on here then full dose is 50ml for an 80L and therefore would be 150ml for your 240L?

So dosing 25ml means you're only dosing at 1/6 EI at the minute? 75ml would be half dose?

Obviously if your mix is different then ignore this
 
Any changes to light or CO2? I have had it melt when any of these factors change. New growth seemingly ok though according to your pictures?

Check expiry of your carbon?

Suggest putting some in emersed culture otherwise you may lose the lot.
 
If your EI mix is as per the APFUK or the mix Ceg mentions in his article on here then full dose is 50ml for an 80L and therefore would be 150ml for your 240L?

So dosing 25ml means you're only dosing at 1/6 EI at the minute? 75ml would be half dose?

Obviously if your mix is different then ignore this

My bottle mix is 'as per instructions' - less phosphates which I've increased from 1 tsp to 4 tsp. I've just revisited the APFUK instruction card and they recommend 10ml per 50l (with, I'm assuming, CO2 injection). So, for approx 200l of water my 25ml dose would be just over 1/2 which I believe is recommended for non injected tanks?

Your input is appreciated but I'll await others to chime in before changing anything. :)

[Awaits a roasting from Clive] :D
 
="rebel, post: 523183, member: 13913"]Any changes to light or CO2? I have had it melt when any of these factors change. New growth seemingly ok though according to your pictures?
Yes, new growth seems fine - and they are growing.

Check expiry of your carbon?
All good.

Suggest putting some in emersed culture otherwise you may lose the lot.
I hope not!
 
[Awaits a roasting from Clive] :D
Well, I mean, I wish I had a tupence for every time I had to say that meting is cause by poor CO2.
Why does everyone ignore that fact and immediately jump on the nutrient bandwagon?
If it can be confirmed that the damage is not due to predation, then ANY structural fault must immediately cast suspicion on CO2 since Carbon builds structure.
The reasons why this (and other) symptoms are due to carbon shortfall is summarized in the post https://ukaps.org/forum/threads/why-are-these-plants-doing-this.33496/#post-356796
The formation of Superoxides and Reactive Oxygen Species does not generally occur with nutrient shortfalls.

I have no idea what 8ml Liquid Carbon means in terms of bottle dosing, but it may require more. Normally, 2X-3X bottle recommendation is a typical suggestion.
As the plants accrue greater mass then they require more of everything.
As new leaves grow in they are better adapted to the conditions but may suffer the same fate later on as the become larger.
As rebel mentioned, lighting might be an issue.

Cheers,
 
My bottle mix is 'as per instructions' - less phosphates which I've increased from 1 tsp to 4 tsp. I've just revisited the APFUK instruction card and they recommend 10ml per 50l (with, I'm assuming, CO2 injection). So, for approx 200l of water my 25ml dose would be just over 1/2 which I believe is recommended for non injected tanks?

Your input is appreciated but I'll await others to chime in before changing anything. :)

[Awaits a roasting from Clive] :D

Ah yeh I couldn't remember if the APFUK mix was the same and is slightly confusing as they link Clives mix on here but post a different version which is a bit lighter than Clives
 
Thing is; if I turn down my lighting intensity, things are gonna get dark in there real quick. I have masses of Phoenix moss in there which is Excel sensitive so maybe upping that isn’t an option. Maybe the expense (and faff) of injection is on the cards...
 
Thing is; if I turn down my lighting intensity, things are gonna get dark in there real quick. I have masses of Phoenix moss in there which is Excel sensitive so maybe upping that isn’t an option. Maybe the expense (and faff) of injection is on the cards...
Or you could just trim the damaged leaves off and carry on. I definitely would not recommend that you go through the hassle of injection, which often causes more problems than it solves. Just trim the leaves or even thin out the helferi. If the new leaves are undamaged then just give them a chance and see how they adapt.

If you were having widespread failure then that would be a different story, but if the damage is limited to the carpet then a little pruning will go a long way.

Cheers,
 
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