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60-P amazon scape

Thanks for your replies!

@zozo Interesting to see that you also add magnesium.

In most EI index guides I didn't read anything about the calcium/magnesium/potassium ratio (2: 1: 0.5).
On this website I found a good explanation:
The corellation between calcium, magnesium and potassium
The ratio

Both magnesium and calcium are nutrients for aquatic plants. Magnesium is similar to the important plant nutrient iron responsible for the formation of chlorophyll. It is consumed very little by the aquarium plants, but should be available in sufficient quantities (over 10 mg / l is recommended). In aquaristic practice, ratios of calcium to magnesium of about 3:1 to 4:1 have been found to be effective. A fairly modern approach is even an even lower ratio of only 2:1. Since many metal ions dissolved in the water compete for the nutrient uptake of aquatic plants, the macronutrient potassium (K) is added in the calculation. It is recommended that the content of magnesium should be higher than that of potassium. This is termed as the calcium/magnesium/potassium ratio, which ideally moves in the range of 2: 1: 0.5.
Click to expand...

I'm still wondering if adding magnesium is a good idea since I have fairly hard tapwater.
The anual report of my tapwater is saying that I have:

Ca 55 mg/l
Mg 6 mg/l
and a total hardness of 9.1°D

Since a much lower total hardness is often recommanded for a good plant growth (3-5°D?), I'm wondering if I still should add magnesium.
With the EI I'm dosing now my water contains 12 mg/l potassium.

(2) Calcium 55 mg/l
(1) Magnesium 6 mg/l>adjust to 25 mg/l
(0.5) Potassium 12 mg/l

To get close to the ratio of 2:1:0.5 I could adjust my magnesium level to 25 mg/l.
But that would mean that my total hardness reaches 13.4°D?
Are my calculations and thoughts right? RO water is not an option for me, would like to hear your thoughts!
 
I do not realy follow reports and measurments, i mainly look at my plants as an index.. Search the forum for Darrels Duckweed index. It aint only about duckweed any easy growing floating plant can do or other emersed growing plants that are fed via the tankwater. :) This is much more reliable than following anual water reports from the water company.

For example my company tells me i have an average of 6ppm Mg from the tap. That should say it's enough... But most fast growing plants i grow tell me other wise and show the need more. 1 the water report is not correct,which is most likely at times, it constantly fluctuates or 2 the plants consume it faster than i can add with water changes from the tap. I don't know and actualy i do not care. :) With adding 3ppm = 3mg/l extra on top to keep most plants i grow happy.

But than also keep in mind it aint equal for all plants, some require more Mg than others.. These are your weakest links. I also have an aqaurium i absolutely do not fertilize over the water column. This tank only grows anubias, Bolbitis and a syngonium growing emersed. The syngonium grows like a rocket with what it gets from the tap and the fish. The 2 others grow so slow they also do not mind. Also still have a emersed Echinodorus growing in that tank that needs a root tab now and then. This is the only plant showing deficiency.

I have no idea where you got the 25mg/l Magnesium. Adding 2 or 3 mg/l is sufficient if you add. 1mg/l equals 1ppm and 1 gram Mg on 100L water equals about 1ppm.. 1 or 3 mg/l this doesn't realy affect the Gh that much.. And plants requiring less than you add do not suffer from it.

So as said to know excactly how much you need to add of all to make all plants equaly happy is not easy. Simply because of the different requirments in differnt plants in differend circumstances. Not to go bonkers and panic over checking values i simply do not use those numbers anymore. Personaly i have sufficient succes with adding enough ferts (maybe slightly more than you need) on a weekly basis A la Redfield Ratio / EI and reset the tank weekly with a water change before i add ferts again. I do not care about Ph and not about Gh nor kH.. I keep averagely safe and just watch my plants.. If they look sufficiently happy i'm happy.

That's my take on it.. :) Take it easy.. Don't drive yoursef mad with scientific formulas.. Unless you like it, it definitively is fun to know, not a need to know.. But than you need to wait for someone else to guid you through that.. :thumbup: Not that i don't want to, i know there much more knowledgable people here doing a beter job explaing it..
 
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zozo said:
That's my take on it.. :) Take it easy.. Don't drive yoursef mad with scientific formulas.. Unless you like it, it definitively is fun to know, not a need to know.. But than you need to wait for someone else to guid you through that.. :thumbup: Not that i don't want to, i know there much more knowledgable people here doing a beter job explaing it..
Click to expand...

You are right, I shouldn't be too fixated on water parameters. For now I will work with EI and see how my plants respond.
I'm trying to understand how much and how many nutrients I should add to make a good start.
Maybe I'm trying too hard not to mess things up :D

I do not have the MgSO4 yet, so I'll try the first two weeks without adding any of it.

I guess the best way is to try for myself, watch the plants grow and see if the minor changes I do have effect... thanks!
 
Hi all,
zozo said:
Search the forum for Darrel's Duckweed index
Click to expand...
Using floating, or emergent plants, as an indicator of nutrient status works because the plants "know" what is in the water. It doesn't seem as scientific as water testing, but it is a valid scientific method. You just need any quick growing plant with access to aerial CO2.
aquacoen said:
With the EI I'm dosing now my water contains 12 mg/l potassium.

(2) Calcium 55 mg/l
(1) Magnesium 6 mg/l>adjust to 25 mg/l
(0.5) Potassium 12 mg/l
Click to expand...
The tank looks pretty healthy, but adding a bit more magnesium isn't going to hurt if you have enough already. Magnesium and potassium deficiencies effect new leaves, because both elements are mobile within the plant, and the obvious symptom for both is yellowing chlorotic leaves, so you get a pretty instant greening response when you add them if they are deficient.

I don't know where the suggested Ca:Mg:K ratio come from as there isn't a scientific reference on the Aquasabi page.

I'm not convinced that the potassium (K) ratio should be so much lower than the levels of calcium (Ca) and magnesium (Mg). Plants need about as much potassium as nitrogen (N), and about 10 times more of those two macro-nutrients than they do of any of the other nutrients. Because you have a lot of calcium in the water, I'd definitely add some magnesium (as "Epsom salts") and carry on adding the potassium (K).

cheers Darrel
 
Thanks for your input Darrel. I added some magnesium. So far EI is really working for me. After two weeks I see better growth and Limnobium Laevigatum is making bigger and greener new leaves. I also notice a tiny bit more algae, especially on the glass. Next week I'll measure my NO3, maybe it's a little high since I introduced new inhabitants to my tank..

After quit a long search I managed to buy some Hyphessobrycon amapaensis (10x) and Nannostomus marginatus (6x). I also added more Otocinclus macrospilus (5x total). Since the oto's are with five instead of three their behaviour is less nervous..

I really like the dwarf pencilfish although mine are a form from Suriname or Guyana and not from Brazil.. close enough! :D
The amapaensis look slightly underfed. For now I feed every day (frozen and flakes) and I'm considering to cultivate artemia.

Some photos of my new inhabitants:
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After two weeks of using dry salts I was very excited to see Limnobium laevigatum getting bigger and greener leaves.
Another two weeks later this what it looks like now:

DSC03290.jpg

LL has never been so sad looking.. The things that have changed in the last weeks are my water temperature (from 24C to 25C), I added the 20 new fishes mentioned in my earlier post and I turned on central heating in my living room this month.

Nevertheless my guess is that this is caused by a nutrient deficiency? What nutrients do you guys think I should add more after looking at the picture? Not only the leaves are in bad shape, but so are the roots. In the past the roots were over 15cm long..

Myriophyllum mattogrossense has started to rot and some stems got loose from the substrate.
This plant is not growing well since I planted because of poor CO2 distribution on that side of my tank and not enough light but now it's getting worse...

I also see that I have some mould in my micro stock solution. I'll make a new batch (halved) and store it in the fridge (I now store it in my aquarium cabinet).
 
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Edvet said:
Doesn''t look like a deficiency to me, more like rot or damage. How are the roots?
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The roots are now 1cm long, and two months ago over 15cm long.. Is it possible that my fish are eating the roots?
What can cause rotting floaters? Or did I damage them with water changes? (I use a watering can with a sprinkler)
 
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Thanks for your thoughts on the Limnobium. For now I'll just be more careful with water changes and see what happens.

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This week I prepared two pieces of spiderwood for some emersed growth. On one piece I used the earlier mentioned 'hygrolon' in combination with christmas moss and a Peperomia species I got from @zozo ,thanks again! On the other piece I didn't use hygrolon but only some christmass moss and a small orchid (Pleurothallis grobyi). The piece with the orchid on it is on a dry spot and not directly under my aquarium light. For now I think I'll spray the orchid every other day. Any thoughts?

I'm making some changes in my scape, when things are settled in I'll make some photo's, I hope this is going to work ;)
 
Nice journal.
Do you know what ‘fixed’ your staurogyne repens issue?
I unfortunately found that the marginatus pencilfish were jumpers in an open topped aquarium, hope yours have been ok? The fish in your tank do look awesome though.
Cheerio,
Ady.
 
Ady34 said:
Nice journal.
Do you know what ‘fixed’ your staurogyne repens issue?
I unfortunately found that the marginatus pencilfish were jumpers in an open topped aquarium, hope yours have been ok? The fish in your tank do look awesome though.
Cheerio,
Ady.
Click to expand...

I think changing my CO2 levels (2 hours before lights turn on) and better flow fixed my staurogyne repens issue.. Although I noticed some spontaneous 'melting?' this week in one spot. There was a lot of debris piled up underneath.. I'll update soon with some pictures.

So far I luckily had no jumping pencilfish. I really like their behaviour, I still have five left of the six I bought. Three of them are probably females cause they are slightly bigger and look kinda stocky. Unfortunately breeding them will be difficult because my tap water is fairly hard.. Maybe one day I will start with RO water.. ;)
 
Pleased the pencils are staying in the tank. Some people find stauro easy, I’ve not really had much luck with it.
 
Time for an update!
After some struggles with EI dosing, (especially micro dosing; I now dose 2x10ml profito a week...the powders didn't work for me) plants are growing well. Still have some BBA that I spot dose with easy carbo and remove manually. Staurogyne repens is growing back after some melting occurred; still wondering why, might had to do something with bad CO2 distribution. (I shortened my inlet filter-hose and now have better flow.. still wonder why I didn't notice this earlier!:rolleyes: My outlet filter-hose is longer so I have better CO2 uptake with my inline diffusor). Fish are doing great. I feed them live artemia once a week and frozen food every other day.

fin1.jpg

I removed this bad boy out of my tank to make place for some red plants! (Helanthium bolivianum ´angustifolius´)

fin0.jpg

Took out a lot of roots as well!

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I also thought my tank could you use some red colours in it so I decided to add Alternanthera rosaefolia. Can also be found in Brazil!

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I'm still working on my emersed plant section but it is finally taking shape! Here you see Tillandsia tricholepis, Tillandsia aeranthos, Peperomia hoffmannii(?) (I got from @zozo !), Pleurothallis tripterantha hanging on my Twinstar and Pleurothallis grobyi in the back. The orchids are not growing very fast. I now spray them with water twice a week so the roots can dry out in between watering. Pleurothallis tripterantha is not directly underneath my aquarium light and seems to do it better than the grobyi..

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Since Mimosa pudica didn't like the conditions in my living room, I decided to plant it in the emersed section of my aquarium. It's now doing quite well.

fin5.jpg

Alternanthera rosaefolia is starting to fill up the background.

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I really enjoy my pencil fishes, they like to take shelter underneath the leaves of Hydrocleys nymphoides.
They also seem to really like the roots of my Limnobium laevigatum, not only for shelter but also for food...!

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Little Photoshop experiment: In this picture I combined two pictures: one of the front glass and one of the emersed section.

:thumbup::wave:
 

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