• You are viewing the forum as a Guest, please login (you can use your Facebook, Twitter, Google or Microsoft account to login) or register using this link: Log in or Sign Up

Moving back to Arkansas (US State) EMERGENCY HELP NEEDED!

DutchMuch

Member
Joined
6 Aug 2018
Messages
509
Location
Hartwell, GA (U.S.)
So im moving back to arkansas soon (back to our same previous, new house)

And im in a Huge "WTF" mode with what i should do with my 40b dutch.

The water up there is LIQUID ROCK, the pH is above 7.8 and the gh is through the roof from what i remember

Here are our current options:

1- Our house is connected to a water softener, so we cant use this water for the tank due to high silicates and in my experience it messes everything up

2- We have a WELL at the house, i haven't tested this water, but i figure its exactly the same as the tap water (Liquid Cement/Rock)

3- I submit to purchasing and remove 300-400 dollars from my car fund to purchase a R/O system to use for this entire operation. And set this up where the water softener is.


Here is what i currently have to do, since i do not know the parameters of the Well water, i need to get it professionally tested. How can i do this? My step father told me i can Send it off for around 50$ to get it tested at some facility. Can i do this? how? if not what do i do? im kind of in panic mode. My scapes here in georgia (8gh/8kh out of tap, and a 6.8 pH base) have done absolutely nothing but thrive. And from what i remember in arkansas they all where Awful and extremely unhealthy due to liquid rock water.
 
Sorry to hear about your problem. There was a recent thread on tgevforum on softening water which may be of sone help

https://www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/how-do-you-make-yours-soft.56364/#post-548214


My suggestion would be to adapt your style and go for a more Walsted appproach to allow you reduce the water changes and perhaps store rain water/ use melted snow. You have mastered growing emersed so you do have a 'back stop' stock of plants and can experiment with different alternatives.
 
I have heard that Tom Barr used to grow most species even with hard water. I reckon you should go with it and see what can grow. Inject CO2 of course .

With the well its best to get it professionally tested esp for heavy metals .
 
Although not the cheapest option, number three, an RO system gets my vote. RO water remineralised to your spec will be consistent and dependable, two things we value in this hobby. If further down the line the well water becomes a viable option keep the RO unit or sell second hand.

Solves your problem immediately and gives options further down the line.
 
I had similar tap water living in Milton Keynes. It's drawn from one of the UK's principal aquifers...the chalk aquifer. It's rock 'ard, with a pH of around 7.8, sometimes 7.6 on special occasions. I remember trying to test it for hardness; I gave up adding reagent in the end, suffice it to say it became irrelevant after a while.
The kettle used to scale up within a few days, and pop and bang when it boiled. Limescale residue around the top of the tank was a total PITA to remove.
But plants didn't care and grew really well, especially those which can synthesis their own carbon from bicarbonates...I think Tom Barr calls that kind of tap water, "magic water" since you'll never have a problem with Ca and Mg deficiency.
Most fish couldn't really give a tinker's cuss either, most are captive bred in the same water.
So don't panic and carry on regardless, you may get some die back whilst your plants adapt to the new water parameters, but maintaining good CO2 flow and distribution will still be the key to success.
 
Don't have the experience with hard water but i second Tim's advice. It's better to grow what you can in hard water ( which is almost all) and have the possibility to do large waterchanges without having to think about waterquality, compared to having to prepare water and be limited in the amount/ frequency. I love being able to do large waterchanges with my garden hose and let it run for a while.
 
To be fair here’s the water report for where I live DutchMuch:


pH average 7.78 (min 7.63 max 8.04)

upload_2019-2-6_9-21-27.jpeg



Having gone from RO to tap with these very hard water parameters in the past, plants do adapt as Tim mentioned. Also Edvet’s point about large water changes is golden. Maybe take the chance?
 
Our house is connected to a water softener, so we cant use this water for the tank due to high silicates and in my experience it messes everything up
Very much doubt it, that it will be silicates. No one has really proved or shown silicates cause issues in domestic fresh water aquariums. What it will be is sodium salts. A house ion exchange water softener will convert the hard waters calcium and magnesium carbonate to sodium carbonate which doesn't interfere with the lathering action of soaps. Sodium salts of any form have no place in fresh water aquariums, which is why ion exchange water cannot (must not) be used.

What you can do, and is actually law in some States in US, is use potassium chloride instead of salt (sodium chloride) in your water softener. This softened water, now containing potassium carbonate can be used in a fresh water aquarium acting as a fine plant fertiliser. Drawback is potassium chloride is more expensive that sodium chloride.

Basically, as many have pointed out above, fish and plants don't really care about water hardness and it is so much better to try and work with the tap water you have rather than faff around making purer water.

If you are worried about heavy metals and other contaminants, especially if well water, then investigate & invest in a HMA filter for your water.
 
What about rain water and 1/2 or 1/3 cut it with tap? I'd still get the well tested though - might turn up to be at least a bit better than the tap.
Yes that will work, softening the water. Just remember to use dechlorinator as well, eg Prime to remove chorine/chloramine as well has heavy metals from the tap water.
 
Yes that will work, softening the water. Just remember to use dechlorinator as well, eg Prime to remove chorine/chloramine as well has heavy metals from the tap water.

Perhaps a good idea to check state laws too, as harvesting rain water can be illegal.
 
Hi all,
state laws too, as harvesting rain water can be illegal
That is a new one for me.
.....Western water rights can be an impediment to rainwater harvesting efforts because the doctrine of prior appropriation has created ambiguity about the legality of intercepting and storing rainwater. In the strictest interpretation, diverting rainwater to a collection system is a taking of a water previously appropriated. This issue has been overlooked for many community rain barrel initiatives, because the individual storage units are relatively small. The City of Seattle, however, obtained a citywide water-right permit to ensure the legality of water harvesting efforts. State legislation may ultimately be necessary to ensure the legality of rainwater harvesting and establish the upper capacity limit for rainwater systems. Any efforts should fully assess the watershed impacts of rainwater harvesting efforts. Colorado law, for instance has assumed that all rainfall eventually reaches groundwater or surface waters and is therefore appropriated....
from the EPA handbook - <"Rainwater harvesting policies">.

cheers Darrel
 
What about rain water and 1/2 or 1/3 cut it with tap? I'd still get the well tested though - might turn up to be at least a bit better than the tap.
i called my mother who is currently living up there, and she said we DID have a water report done on the well (agricultural reasons) despite what my step father said, and i have seen it before and know its basically the same out of tap so the Well idea is out now.

Hi all, That is a new one for me. from the EPA handbook - <"Rainwater harvesting policies">.

cheers Darrel
in arkansas we live on a 30 acre property, and the house was built as a modern self sufficient house, we have 2 3,000g rain barrels collecting rain haha

It is not illegal here but im some/most cities it is very illegal to do this. (personally i think its stupid but i have no say)

Walsted appproach to allow you reduce the water changes and perhaps store rain water/ use melted snow. You have mastered growing emersed so you do have a 'back stop' stock of plants and can experiment with different alternatives.
this is exactly what i feared having to do. I'd rather tear it down before i did this! HIGH TECH OR NOTHING! lol

Although not the cheapest option, number three, an RO system gets my vote. RO water remineralised to your spec will be consistent and dependable, two things we value in this hobby. If further down the line the well water becomes a viable option keep the RO unit or sell second hand.

Solves your problem immediately and gives options further down the line.
I have a years old friend who helped me with this, he said your better going with R/O (which is now proving itself sadly but at least i know now what i need to do if not just take it all down) and he recommended a 200$ R/O system to me which isnt to much a break in the budget. So its definitely in high consideration.

I had similar tap water living in Milton Keynes. It's drawn from one of the UK's principal aquifers...the chalk aquifer. It's rock 'ard, with a pH of around 7.8, sometimes 7.6 on special occasions. I remember trying to test it for hardness; I gave up adding reagent in the end, suffice it to say it became irrelevant after a while.
The kettle used to scale up within a few days, and pop and bang when it boiled. Limescale residue around the top of the tank was a total PITA to remove.
But plants didn't care and grew really well, especially those which can synthesis their own carbon from bicarbonates...I think Tom Barr calls that kind of tap water, "magic water" since you'll never have a problem with Ca and Mg deficiency.
Most fish couldn't really give a tinker's cuss either, most are captive bred in the same water.
So don't panic and carry on regardless, you may get some die back whilst your plants adapt to the new water parameters, but maintaining good CO2 flow and distribution will still be the key to success.
Co2 up there isnt to much of an issue, although i (will be) live in a very rural area, nearest co2 refill is an hour away and its not even THAT DAY refilling, i'd have to return. Which i can do its just so inconvenient... But thats not an issue. I think im still leaning towards R/O just to be safe because when i grew pogo erectus in that hard water it died almost immediately, same with most plants. My experience was Not positive in those water conditions.



Maybe take the chance?

This is a good question.

Right now my tank is host to some expensive (what i consider expensive) and rare stems atm, and other plants i like a lot. Having them have the Possibility to completely DIE without R/O (example) and not return and Lose over 300$ in plants rather than baseline purchasing a 200$ product to save the plants.... I dont know. I guess this is something to think over. I have a few months i think to think this over but i like planning ahead of course.
 
Take cuttings and sell surplus to win some money back.?
Nah, i used to sell a lot but recently ive died down. Due to work, school, being busy in general. Even though i'd like to do that recently i simply haven't seen an opening or chance to get to. + in the US its pretty cold rn in most places, so sales are pretty dead on forums at least
 
Grow them emersed?
yea i could do that, some cant be grown emersed but most can :p im already doing this.

Lol in the long run though i have a 10 ft x 12 ft greenhouse in arkansas i used to grow BUNCHES of emersed plants in. I still find interest in growing emersed but u know taking down my entire tank just to grow emersed
i wouldnt have started this hobby in the first place like 4 years ago if that were the case
 
It is settled, i will buy an RO system when i move. Havent specifically picked one but thats over now thank goodness.

Now that i have decided to just throw down the towel and use the RO system, I have some major questions i hope to get answered because when it comes to RO im a Straight up noob. i know NOTHING about it.

Now, i know RO lowers pH but im not sure how much
i also know it removes Everything virtually from the water.

How do i get the proper gh/kh i desire? (8gh/8kh)

How do i get the proper pH i desire? (around 7.0)

How do i Re Mineralize it?

and How do i use an RO system period? The system in the house will be Most likely housed OUTSIDE connected to the well water tap. So we will make a special plastic housing for it so it doesnt ruin by weathering, etc. And when it gets cold i can simply bring it inside. Im not to worried about that part. I know an RO system takes about a 1/4 ratio of RO/Waste water so it takes a while to collect water from.

So seeing as this system will be housed outside, and my tank will be inside, how will i get the RO water from outside, to inside? There must be a better way than buckets? hmm Again not to worried about this part as i am Using it in general, and finding out what params it will make.
 
Back
Top