Algae problem.

Conort2

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Try not to worry to much about the nitrates. If I was you I’d get some floating plants and some really fast growing weeds to compete with the algae.

Get some hygrophila polysperma or difformis and then some amazon frogbit. The tank Is very new so the plants will need some time to settle down and compete against the algae. Some of your plants are growing as you can see the height difference in the rotala at the back, It just needs a bit more time.

cheers

Conor
 

Wilksy

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Thanks for the replies, with regard to flow i have changed the glass lily pipe set to a Blau steel set, the flow around the tank certainly seems energetic and I have the skimmer part of it flying round like a water wheel, I would prefer not to spoil the tank aesthetics with to much "stuff" in the tank.

With regard to the hygrophila polysperma how could I plant that as I have no real room in the substrate, is it OK to leave it in its pot for this purpose, also with the floating plants won't they be hurled around the top of the tank due to the flow which is fairly vigorous.
 

dw1305

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Hi all,
also with the floating plants won't they be hurled around the top of the tank due to the flow which is fairly vigorous
If you really have a lot of surface flow they won't enjoy themselves. If they go around in circles it is fine, if they all end up rammed against the glass then it won't work.

cheers Darrel
 

Wilksy

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No the dose recommendation on the bottle is less than what I am dosing, it was recommended by Aquarium Gardens, I can dose whatever is needed as its fully automatic
 

jaypeecee

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No the dose recommendation on the bottle is less than what I am dosing, it was recommended by Aquarium Gardens, I can dose whatever is needed as its fully automatic

I am feeling a little defeated at the moment, this is my first foray into a proper planted tank and it seems like money literally down the drain - help.

Hi @Wilksy

Have you contacted Aquarium Gardens to inform them of the predicament that you now find yourself in? If they recommended the ferts dosing regime, perhaps they made an error calculating the dosage? A lot of light and too much plant nutrients in the water with plants that are not yet established may explain the algae that you are currently seeing - in my opinion.

JPC
 
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The standard low-tech dosage for TNC Complete is 1ml per 10 litres, once per week. Your tank is about 100 litres, so that dose would be 10ml.

TNC say you can triple that dose for an approximation to EI, which would put you at 30ml. This is the rate I was using, until I worked out the nutrient content and realised that it actually puts you at the generous end of EI for nitrate, but at a somewhat lean EI for phosphate and potassium. I therefore switched to a “double-triple” dose, and saw an improvement in growth.

But the “double-triple” dose makes it rather over-generous on nitrate, which isn’t necessarily a problem except some red plants won’t go as red.

I’m assuming you’re dosing 9ml per day; is that correct? If so, that means you’re dosing the “double-triple” dose. This should be fine. Slightly richer on nitrates than strictly necessary (and accounts for your 20ppm nitrate reading, which is also fine), but it won’t be the cause of your algae.

I’ve actually since switched to DIY salts, which allows me to go slightly leaner on nitrate while keeping phosphate and potassium at the top end of EI range. I’m trying to make my Rotala walichii go pinker!

By the way, at some point I do recommend switching to DIY salts. TNC Complete is good, but it’ll start getting expensive if you’re using the “double-triple” dose.
 

Wilksy

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I have tried to ring them numerous times but without any success, do you think I may be dosing to heavily I got plenty of plant growth but also plenty of algae growth as well.

I would also like to know what I can do with my Monte Carlo as it seems to be growing well but not attached to the substrate anymore.

Yes I am dosing 9ml per day in my other tank I dose 3ml per day this too is 100L I'm open to any suggestions as it gets very depressing cleaning off all the green and brown algae only to see it all back the next day.

I've ordered the floating plants as suggested, these will be with me today so will get introduced tonight after I've done today's 50% water change.

I do have access to unlimited RO water which I used to use in my other tank but did find it a bit a faff bringing home, I then went to a 50-50 of tapwater and RO water so perhaps I should go to RO mix in my Aquascaper.
 

jaypeecee

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I have tried to ring them numerous times but without any success, do you think I may be dosing to heavily I got plenty of plant growth but also plenty of algae growth as well.

Hi @Wilksy

In order for the algae to grow, it/they need nutrients - obviously. Therefore, yes, you appear to be dosing too heavily.

I'd email Aquarium Gardens in the hope that someone will read your email when they get a moment to do so.

JPC
 
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The “double-triple” dose of TNC Complete is giving:

40ppm nitrate (EI recommends up to 30)
3.7ppm phosphate (EI recommends up to 3)
30ppm potassium (EI recommends up to 30)

So the nitrate and phosphate are a little higher than the upper level of EI. Potassium is bang-on the upper level.

When I set up my nano tank recently, I dosed the manufacturer-recommended triple dose of TNC Complete initially, but after a number of weeks I felt that growth was a little poor. I had heard of AG’s recommendation of the “double-triple” dose, and worked out what that would give in terms of ppm per week. I switched to that regime for 2-3 weeks and I believe growth improved. I certainly didn’t get any algae as a result of this.

So you could do something similar yourself, maybe try a couple of weeks on the normal “triple” dose and see how things go. Maybe your plants are not yet grown-in enough to outcompete the algae; hopefully the floating plants will help.
 

Wilksy

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tank1.jpg
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So last night was the every other day water change and clean out, the fist picture shows the amount of algae that had grown in basically 48 hrs. We removed as much as we could, replanted the Monte Carlo, planted the hygrophila polysperma and floated the amazon frogbit along with a 80% water change.
The additional pictures show the tank after the clean up, the drop counter is blue as it was above water level for some time and the co2 turns off at 19:30 as lights out is 20:30.

I will take a picture tonight and post up the algagrowth in a 24hr period
 

Sammy Islam

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Aquarium gardens have always recommended using "TNC complete" with the dosing instructions of the "aquascaper complete"...... 5ml tnc complete per 50L of water daily. So for you 10ml a day. (60ml a week if you don't dose on water change day)

From previous use of TNC complete using rotala butterfly is great to figure out whats in the dose, 70ml per week would give you:

Screenshot_20200430-134312__01.jpg
 
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And you may find it useful to convert the above figures to nitrate (NO₃) and phosphate (PO₄).

You need to multiply the N figure by 4.4 to give 46.5ppm of NO₃
And multiply the P figure by about 3 to give 4.3ppm of PO₄
 

JoshP12

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8 Dec 2019
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Hi all,

I found this data (as I have never used that light):
Twinstar 600S - PAR readings
Hi all,

Just tested my Twinstar 600S using an Apogee MQ-510 on my 60-P. I was going to make a fancy chart, but the density of plants in my tank aren't ideal for consistent depth measurements... so this is what I can give you.

The fixture has fixed legs, meaning the minimum distance to water is 4". All measurements are from the bottom of the LED array to the top of the submerged sensor.

100% power, 0" from fixture's midline:

4" depth: 300PAR
10" depth: 160PAR
15" depth: 125PAR

100% power, 5.5" from fixture's midline (ie- front edge of tank):

4" depth: 70PAR
10" depth: 150PAR
15" depth: 125PAR

Dimming power resulted in a linear reduction in PAR across the board... so at half power, PAR was reduced by 50%, etc.

That is for the S series; I read that the intensities are the same -- perhaps someone with both lights can chime in, but I can't imagine they are that different.

You are at 60%, so you are likely at least 75 ish PAR at substrate (since the AS600 is 320 mm high)... reducing it down to 50% will take you to 62 ish, then 40 down to probably 50.

It may be an idea to reduce the light - just don't go too far (the plants still need the light - I have made this mistake).

Josh
 

Wilksy

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Explains why the Nitrate test is high, I'm using 63ml per week as I dose 9ml everyday including water change days which is currently at 4 per week.
 
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I’m not sure that we’ve determined that it’s too heavy, only that it’s higher than EI. And EI is very approximate anyway.

It has been shown beyond reasonable doubt that high nutrients are not, on their own, a cause of algae.

I dosed AG’s suggested “double-triple” dose for several weeks, and had no algae at all. In fact, now that I’ve switched to DIY salts with a leaner nitrate level I have now got tiny, tiny areas of BGA. I’m hoping this is just a temporary reaction as things adjust to the change, but it just shows that it’s far too simplistic to say that excess nutrients cause algae.
 
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If I were you, @Wilksy, I’d be tempted to really crank up that CO₂ - you’ve got no creatures to worry about yet, right?

Assuming no creatures, I’d get that drop checker yellow!

Your plants are not nutrient-limited. And your light is, I think, reasonable at this stage of the tank’s maturity. Which leaves the question of CO₂, and I’m not sure we’ve properly established that the level and distribution of CO₂ is good.

As far as I know, excess CO₂ will never cause a problem with plants or algae; it’s only a problem to creatures. So I’d crank it up, to ensure that your plants aren’t CO₂ limited. Let’s get those plants growing properly, and then they can start to outcompete the algae. Later you can gradually reduce the CO₂ down to a creature-safe level.

If you feel it necessary, you certainly can reduce your nutrient dosage a bit, but I really don’t think this is the cause of your problem. I wouldn’t cut it too much though. The manufacturer’s recommendation of a triple dose (30ml per week for your tank) is, in my opinion, rather too lean for a heavily planted tank. I can totally see why AG suggest doubling that, although it results in slightly over-generous nitrate and phosphate. A cynic might think that they’re trying to sell more product!
 

Wilksy

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Right the problem is still exactly the same, green slime after less than 24hrs and brown algae after pretty much the same period after a clean and water change. I getting seriously fed up with this now, I have turned up the CO2, added loads of floating plants (growing like mad) and still do 3 x 50%+ water changes per week yet nothing changes, the plants still look awful after a day and the green slime still covers the substrate etc.

What can I do, I really want to move some livestock in but I just don't want to do it whilst I have the algae problem, I'm now going to use RO water totally and add Aquavitro Mineralize, I have unlimited access to free RO so cost isn't an issue.

I need help, which I'm sure my good lady would say anyway:)
 

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