Crptocoryne parva

Discussion in 'Plant Help' started by vauxhallmark, 10 Feb 2008.

  1. vauxhallmark

    vauxhallmark Member

    Messages:
    568
    Has anyone kept C. parva long term?

    I thought I had some a couple of years ago, but it always ended up being a plant about 10 - 15 cm high, so probably not parva.

    I bought a tropica branded pot of it the other day, from a shop that looked like it really was selling genuine tropica plants (I'm sure there's a black market in counterfeit tropica labels though - for another post!). The plants (I separated the mass into 13 plants - pretty good going, and I could have got more out of it if I'd been desperate) are about 3 - 4 cms high, exactly what I want. However, the shape of the stalk and leaf looks identical to the small plants I had before that I thought were parva.

    I've only had them a few weeks, and they look great, have put out a few new leaves (same size so far) so I'm hoping that they might stay small.

    Brings me back to the original question, finally. What experience has anyone had of growing this plant long term, what kind of conditions did you give it, and how big did it get?

    If mine do take off and get enormous again when they settle in I'm going to try replacing a section of the substrate with plain sand/gravel, and try again like that.

    For info, mine are currently growing in eco complete, with moderately bright lighting in a 45 x 30 x 30cm tank, CO2 and Tropica Plant+.

    Thanks in advance for any info! One of the reasons I love crypts so much is the variety of forms individual species (and even individual plants) can take depending on their circumstances, but this is one case I'd like them to stick to one look (small!).

    Cheers,

    Mark
     
  2. ceg4048

    ceg4048 Expert/Global Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    8,937
    Location:
    Chicago, USA
    Hi,
    Welcome to the forum. C. parva should stay small long term. It just gets bushier although the stalks might get slightly longer. You might have had a Crypt misidentified. I've had them long term in a high light EI tank. As I said, they stayed small but just got healthier and bushier requiring the occasional thining.

    Cheers,
     
  3. Ed Seeley

    Ed Seeley Member

    Messages:
    3,262
    Location:
    Nottingham
    I've got two Crypts bought as C.parva. One is almost certainly what you had first of all and is actually a hybrid called C.x willisii 'lucens'. It is very similar to C.parva but larger overall. I have just planted my ones of these into some compost to try growing them emersed.
    The other one I have seems to be the true C.parva at the moment. It is staying small and neat growing submersed.
     
  4. nry

    nry Member

    Messages:
    1,239
    Location:
    Cumbria, UK
    Are there any other similarly small plants like this one? Wondered about some parva for ages, though the description from Tropica about them getting thin stemmed/leaved after growing under water puts me off slightly...if they truely stay small and low I may fork out for a pot, think I need a little more interest lower down my water levels...
     
  5. vauxhallmark

    vauxhallmark Member

    Messages:
    568
    Thanks for the feedback guys. I suspect that a LOT of cryptocorynes are actually C misidentified - the whole parva, lucens, willisii complex is a nightmare, and wendtii is surely much the same. I think a lot of our plants have been cultivated for so long that it's hard to be sure that no crossing has ever happened over the decades!

    @ ceg4048 - when you say it has stayed small, how small has it stayed and for how long? Currently my longest leaves are about 4cm including stem - but Tropica state a size of 5-10cm - 10cm would be too big for what I want to use it for, that's why I'm experimenting with it in this small tank at the moment.

    @ eds - yeah, I've had loads of different results from so-called lucens, willisii etc. - ranging from plants that do indeed look like big parva (leaf and stem both the same bright green, no definite transition from stem to leaf) to plants that reach 20 cm tall, with coloration from light green through brown, to bronze and striped - still very narrow leaves (5mm), sometimes with slightly wavy edges. I'm not too bothered about strictly identifying them, just enjoy the variety. This parva, though, I specifically want to use in the foreground, and I don't want it much over 5cm - fingers crossed!

    Would love to hear how your emersed culture goes - if I do use it as I hope to (covering quite a large area in a 90cm tank) it would be great if the emersed growth is faster than submerged - I could grow a tray of it before I set up the tank - it ain't cheap for what you get! Are you using pots, or a tank with reduced water level?

    Cheers,

    Mark
     
  6. Ed Seeley

    Ed Seeley Member

    Messages:
    3,262
    Location:
    Nottingham
    Got to agree with all the misidentifications. Even flowering some hybrids you can't make a 100% ID.

    The parva have only just been planted in a covered seed tray on a windowsill and I have a couple of leaves showing. Compost is my standard peat/perlite and osmocote fertiliser I use for my plants in the greenhouse. If they don't do too well I may try a composted bark mix I use for Cyclamen spp. I'll keep you posted on their progress.

    Ed.
     
  7. ceg4048

    ceg4048 Expert/Global Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    8,937
    Location:
    Chicago, USA
    Well, the stems can elongate so that overall height is more than 4cm but I've not had them grow to 10cm. I imagine ther are variations from specimen to specimen ;)

    Cheers,
     
  8. plantbrain

    plantbrain Expert

    Messages:
    1,946
    parva is easy to ID.

    It really liked high light for a few hours each day.

    I had it flower submersed once letting sunlight hit it for a few hours each day with the normal FL's lights.

    Regards,
    Tom Barr
     
  9. vauxhallmark

    vauxhallmark Member

    Messages:
    568
    Any update on how these are growing? It's been one month now.

    My 13 (submerse) haven't done a lot in a month - perhaps one or two leaves each - but I never really worry about crypts for the first month or two. They really seem to have to "think about it" for a while after being moved. Once they start sending out runners the growth in number should increase apace (eg, 13, 26, 52 etc), so fingers crossed for 'em!

    They're still very pretty though, lovely light green, and the new leaves are only fractionally larger than the existing ones - still less than 5cm which is exactly what I was hoping for! They look a lot like miniature spathiphyllum (peace lily), and are a great contrast against the black gravel.

    Eventually I want to combine them with a bit of glosso and hairgrass, over about half the tank (I want it more like a 'meadow' than a 'lawn'), in a medium light tank, which will hopefully stop the glossostigma and eleocharis from swamping the crypts. If it's all too much work I'll go with just the crypts, but I like a bit of wild growth, and I think the contrasting shapes of these three plants would look great. They can also all be grown on emersed as a tight wad way of getting up a good number of plants for minimum outlay.

    Anyone tried this kind of mixed meadow look before? Will Golssostigma always win out and smother any other plants it's planted with? Or will keeping the light moderate overcome this? I know it'll have to be a fine line between stopping it being too rampant, and avoiding tall stringy growth, but I'd like to have a go and see if I can reach a happy medium.

    Any thoughts welcome, and would love to hear how your emersed parva is going, eds, or see a pic. (I would put a pic of mine, but the tank as a whole is looking a bit scruffy - been set up for nearly three years now, and really needs completely redoing, good old clean of algae out from the silicon seams, new substrate etc.. In fact it's my plan for March/April this year, so will post all planned specs in a separate post soon for criticism.)

    Cheers,

    Mark
     
  10. Ed Seeley

    Ed Seeley Member

    Messages:
    3,262
    Location:
    Nottingham
    They're doing very little to be honest! I think some have died but some still have a few leaves. Think they really need more light so will have to wait to go in the greenhouse.

    As to mixing them; from my experiences with a number of carpeting plants the glosso will completely smother al;most aything - it's even overgrowing setcions of my hairgrass at the moment! Maybe Marsilea would be better as it's slower growing IME.
     
  11. vauxhallmark

    vauxhallmark Member

    Messages:
    568
    Sorry they're not doing much yet (but like I said in my previous post, all crypts can seem like they're doing nothing for months after they're moved, and then when they've settled in all hell breaks loose). You've pre-empted me with your suggestion - next thing I was gonna ask was if Marsilea would be a better choice for this plan! I really like the idea of a 'mixed carpet' (ie more of a meadow than a domesticated lawn), and one of my questions on the main set up post was going to be whether Marsilea would be a better choice then Glossostigma for this - I've read a lot about Glossostigma being a real brute in spite of it's size).

    So thanks for the reply, mate, let us know how the emersed crypts are going later.

    PS have you seen how cheap thermostatic propagators can be had for (esp on the interweb)?

    PPS or perhaps the trend of growing plants emersed will really take off, and (whisper it) heating cables
    will once again become a staple piece of equipment! Thank goddess i've still got some lying around! Knew they couldn't have survived in the general horticultural scene for so many decades if they had no use!
     
  12. Ed Seeley

    Ed Seeley Member

    Messages:
    3,262
    Location:
    Nottingham
    I've got a propagator in one of my greenhouses, but rarely use it to be honest now I don't propagate too many plants any more. I think a summer in there with the tomatoes may well get the crypts going. Will let you know how they get on.
     

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