I'm Giving Up With Trying to Keep Shrimp

Discussion in 'Inverts' started by Superman, 7 Sep 2009.

  1. Superman

    Superman Member

    Messages:
    1,804
    Location:
    Cheltenham
    Ever since I've tried to keep shrimp in all different forms (Cherry, Amano, CRS) they've all died.

    Many have died for no obvious reasons with fish being happy and algae there to be eaten.

    Recently, a large amount died during over dosing TPN+ to cope with the few days off in between due to holidays and I've just increased dosing TPN+ to 2ml per day and the remaining two Cherry shrimp have died, one each evening.

    There's been loads of things I've done, the main one stopping doing EasyCarbo as shrimp are sensitive to that.

    Everything I try and do to keep shrimp fails, good tank routine with water changes and feeding now and again due to them having algae to feed on.

    I'm completely stumped, I know that other users cannot keep shrimp for various reasons, but I'm worried now that I don't have shrimp in there, that I don't have a clean up crew. In addition, when I tried to keep snails in my large tank, they died too (assains and nerites) apart from the pest snails.

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated as I don't want to keep killing things.

    :thumbdown:
     
  2. Jase

    Jase Member

    Messages:
    448
    Location:
    Stourbridge
    Off the top of my head, late at night, with no science behind it, have you tried RO water?
     
  3. viktorlantos

    viktorlantos Aquascaper

    Messages:
    1,621
    Location:
    Budapest, Hungary
    I have Amano Shrimp in my large tank. Around 12 of them a year ago. They are doing well. They did not escaped thanks to the tons of plants to hide in. When i tried to add one of those shrimp to my nano tank he escaped immediatelly.

    large tank: http://www.flickr.com/photos/viktorlant ... 084697919/

    Earlier i had 20 Red cherry in a 20 liter low light nano tank before. just in a few months they doubled tripled the community size. they done really well there. with low light, no co2, Tropica TPN+ fert daily with 1ml Easy Carbo. Did water changes there 50% weekly.

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/viktorlant ... 209470556/

    Later on i added in a goup of CRS but they are all died. could be for 2 reasons. the red cherry population just overgrown then the CRS group did not had their own place to settle, but the other reason is they come from a breeder who used soft water with RO. Cherrys were all fine and since i sold the tank they still growing there.

    In my current tank i decided to pick another shrimp the cardinal ones. this shrimp loves the harder water (not like CRS) and they were fine in my high tech tank with high light and co2 with daily 1ml of Carbo and ADA fertilizers. I had 3-4 shimp died from one day to another. but that is happened because of the warm weather and the less oxygen i had in the tank. so i moved up a bit the jet inlet and used air conditioners to keep the 28celsius even in the hotest summer day.

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/viktorlant ... 209187244/

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/viktorlant ... 209187244/

    these are sensitive species. many of them loves to be alone. be in a soft water. shrimps loves extra airing, with that they are doing well with co2 and carbo too. no overfeeding! use special foods to feed them. this year i feed them with the Shirakura shrimp food. This is 100 times better then other general products. Shirakura, Mosura, Ebi Ten are the breeders choice. Use spinach if you want to mix it a little. feed them every other day. Weekly water changes is a must to do. If they have a place to hide, they will breed.

    I had success with them, but need to decide carefuly which version to keep. Some of them are easy others are impossible in a high tech tank. buy from a breeder who keep the shrimps in tap water not RO.

    Hope this helped.
     
  4. Superman

    Superman Member

    Messages:
    1,804
    Location:
    Cheltenham
    It sounds like it could be a o2 issue then as I've always tried to limit surface movement to keep co2 in.
     
  5. JamesC

    JamesC Member

    Messages:
    1,276
    Location:
    Bexley, Kent
    It could be something in the tap water. Cherry shrimp are tuff little things and it takes quite a bit of abuse to kill them. I've found they can take pretty high CO2 levels. Once I overdosed CO2 and all the fish were showing signs of distress but the cherry's carried on as normal without a care in the world. They even survive in a my eheim filter for weeks only to be tipped out into the garden and then scooped up in a net and plonked back in a tank.

    The one thing you have to watch is dosing TPN+, especially if you overdose it as it contains relatively high levels of ammonium. I've never tested it but I believe shrimp are sensitive to ammonium/ammonia.

    Apart from that I can't think of any reason think why your shrimp die. Perhaps set up a nano tank using remineralised RO water. At least it would rule out if your tap water is to blame or not.

    James
     
  6. Superman

    Superman Member

    Messages:
    1,804
    Location:
    Cheltenham
    Thanks James.

    If I get anymore I'll move to EI method via dry ferts and put the TPN+ on hold as I think I'm overdosing for my tank size.
     
  7. aaronnorth

    aaronnorth Member

    Messages:
    3,955
    Location:
    worksop, nottinghamshire
    maybe you have a high coper content in your water (or if you use the hot water pipe to fill back up) and the additional Cu in the fert maybe a reason.
     
  8. Superman

    Superman Member

    Messages:
    1,804
    Location:
    Cheltenham
    I resisted the urge to get some more at the weekend but did change to a DIY all in one solution which seems to be working wonders.

    I wonder if it's temp related in that tank as I don't have a heater in there. I might consider getting an in-line heater but funds are tight as I'm buying a house with the girlfriend.

    It's strange how some life can cope well in some conditions and others not. For example, I added a nerite snail over the weekend, it moved and eat for a day and hasn't moved since.

    I wonder if I'm getting something fundamentally wrong here. :?
     
  9. Iliveinazoo

    Iliveinazoo Member

    Messages:
    130
    Location:
    Southampton
    Could a lack of calcium and magnesium be the problem?
     
  10. a1Matt

    a1Matt Member

    Messages:
    2,498
    Location:
    Bromley
    Hopefully my experience may be of some help...

    I lost half of my shrimp population in one go. Then the other half in one go a couple of months later. I worked out that it was down to two batches of plants I had bought from a LFS had come in from the far east. It appears they had been treated with a chemical upon export, not cleaned, and this chemical killed the shrimp. (The fish went a bit washed out, but no casualties there.)

    I will be trying shrimp again in the near future. I would not try them again if I was not so confident of the cause. Not fair on the little critters IMO (note that I am not preaching here, it is each to their own). I hope you can get the same confidence to try again Clark :)
     
  11. Themuleous

    Themuleous Member

    Messages:
    4,126
    Location:
    Aston, Oxfordshire
    Sounds like something is wrong with the water, if its killing nerites in a few days (although they can be sensitive when first added). Swap to RO if you can, as James says, just to rule it out.

    FYI - I'm pretty sure they are sensitive to NH3/NO2 as I had a loach die in my 60lt and didn't realise. Apart from causing masses of BBA it killed ALL the cherry shrimp in the tank :(

    Sam
     
  12. Polly

    Polly Member

    Messages:
    158
    I keep Amano shrimp. They have thrived in all my tanks, through high temperatures and low, through very soft water lacking in calcium, in acidic blackwater etc. The only time I've seen them in distress, they all moved to the upper part of the tank, congregating on plants and bogwood just below the water surface, my big old Bolivian Ram had died overnight and there was a water quality problem. A big water change later (and removing the Ram) and they were all happy again ;)

    The only time I couldn't keep them alive in a tank was when there was a Short Finned Plakat Betta in there. He'd wait for them to shed their shell then get them while they were soft :( Very expensive snacks!

    loads of info about shrimp!
    http://www.planetinverts.com/shrimp_species.html
     
  13. CeeJay

    CeeJay Member

    Messages:
    945
    Location:
    Surrey UK
    Hi all

    a1Matt
    I have had some advice from my LFS that seems to support your theory.
    I bought some Glosso from my LFS and was told that it was newly imported. I was advised that if I kept shrimp, not to put it straight in the tank. I was told that due to stringent importation laws, the plants had to be treated before they come into the country and the solution that most far east suppliers use is high in chemicals that are toxic to shrimp. I was advised by my LFS to grow the plant outside the tank to start with, as the chemicls take about a week to leach out. I left it in a bucket of water in the garden for 2 weeks (in the summer), and when I added it to the tank I had no shrimp losses :D
    Better to be safe than sorry eh :thumbup:


    Chris
     
  14. basil

    basil Member

    Messages:
    627
    Happened to me just last week, so I can say with some confidence that some plants are treated with some nasty chemicals that shrimp really don't like.

    Bought a batch of 25 stems from ebay. The plants arrived whilst I was at work - wife called me and asked what did I want to do with them? I said, rinse them in some water taken from tank then drop them in the tank until I get home.

    Tank in question was a newly cycled [4 week old] set up. I'd recently aquired and added a dozen Snowball shrimp. :D

    My wife called me maybe 2 hours after adding the plants to say that all of the shrimp were dying! On their backs legs waving - some of them were swimming upside down! Didn't sound at all good! My first reaction was that it MUST be the plants. All of the shrimps had been very happy prior and this was the only change made to the tank. We quickly removed all of the plants and binned them. Also removed the shrimp and placed them in a tub of water taken from another established tank I have. They stayed in the tub until I got home from work.

    I immediately carried out a 50% water change in the tank to try and dilute whatever was on the plants. By this time, the shrimps in the tub had started to look a little better. We slowly acclimatised them and eventually added them back to the original tank. 2-3 hours later, I'd had 2 dead but the other 10 were fine.

    I'm convinced that the plants were to blame and I'll now be very thorough with prepping any plants I want to add to an existing set up containing shrimp.
     
  15. AdAndrews

    AdAndrews Member

    Messages:
    1,125
    Location:
    Kidderminster, Worcs
    ^ that couldnt have been the plants, maybe some kind of chemical they sprayed on them before hand though..
    a couple of my shrimp died the other day, couldnt find what from though, luckily mine are cherries so have been breeding like caarazy!
     
  16. a1Matt

    a1Matt Member

    Messages:
    2,498
    Location:
    Bromley
    Ouch. It's a shame others have had the same experience as me.

    I did a couple of large water changes and also put some new carbon granules in my external to remove any nasties still hanging about. (I do not know if it worked as my shrimp were nearly all gone by then)

    These chemicals are harmful to all aquatic livestock. All retailers know that plants are going to be put into tank with fish in them. Bearing that in mind, I think it is negligent to sell plants without cleaning them prior to sale, or at least to inform the buyer.
     
  17. bogwood

    bogwood Member

    Messages:
    410
    Location:
    Merseyside
    As a planted tank fan with shrimps, i always worry when reading these topics, will it be my turn next to loose my shrimps.
    However so far, touch wood i have had no losses, that are noticable.
    I have two planted tanks with shrimps, both set up slightly different.

    Tank 1.( 18 months old)
    ADA substrat. easy carbo, and tetra CO2.and Tropica plants.heavily planted. ADa Brighty, and step1.
    Ph... 6.3
    Temp.....73
    This tank contains approx 25/30 CRS..........with young of various size.

    Tank 2, ( overall 1 year, but revamped recently)
    ADA/tropica substrat. automatic CO2, with solenoid, Tropica plants, heavily planted, ADA ferts.
    Ph...5.9/6.3
    Temp..73
    This tank contains 40/50 red/super red cherries, ( with babies of various sizes) Armano and otto.

    My maintce for both tanks is;
    Twice weekly water changes, between 20 and 60%. ( no water from hot tap) ALWAYS USING TETRA AQUASAFE.
    So far only bought Tropica plantsfrom from TGM, tempted to buy from other sources, but having read this forum topic, will steer clear of LFS.

    This works for me, so i will continue.
     
  18. basil

    basil Member

    Messages:
    627
    For me, the lesson is don't add new plants to an already established tank. I will always rinse, soak and quarrantine mine from now on!
     
  19. JamesC

    JamesC Member

    Messages:
    1,276
    Location:
    Bexley, Kent
    Plant distributors often add copper sulphate to control snail and pest populations. New plants should always be rinsed prior to putting in your tanks as copper and shrimp don't mix at all well.

    James
     
  20. basil

    basil Member

    Messages:
    627
    Annoying thing is, I asked this exact question before I bought them. SUppose they were likely treated in Asia before they were imported by the UK ebayer.

    Ah well, lesson learn't and I think I was fortunate to get away with only 2 dead out of 12!
     

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