Jungle aquascape

[Karacticus]

Hello, everyone! This is my journal to hopefully chart my progression setting up an aquascape/jungle fish tank. I am loosely going for something that hopefully looks natural and like it could be a jungle river somewhere in South America, but I am not going for anything particularly accurate, so no murky blackwater biotopes! It is a high energy set-up, comprising of the following kit:

• D-D Aqua-Pro Aquascaper 120 (120 x 60 x 45cm and approx. 300 litres)
• Oase Biomaster Thermo 850
• Chihiros WRGB2 Pro
• CO2 Art Pro-Elite regulator and inline diffuser

So far, I have used 18 litres of ADA Amazonia aqua soil capped off in plastic mesh bags and then covered with sand. For hardscape I have gone for a large centre piece of hollow bog wood (hopefully a nice hiding place for plecos) and then I’ve added some river cobbles and detail stones. I wanted something a bit bigger than I currently have for stones – maybe some larger river stones - but my local store wanted £25 per stone which seemed a lot. I have one that is too big, but may try and source some over time if I don’t like the look. I’m trying to go for something natural-looking. Here are some initial photos, more to follow!

I am planning to plant heavy from the off, including plenty of stems. Then stock once mature with South American fish – tetras and maybe a couple of Acaras and Apistogrammas.

I am planning to use EI and have the ferts ready to mix, as directed by @Happi.

Current questions, if anyone wants to help:

• I know to do lots of water changes in the first few weeks. I have read daily in week 1, but could I do every other day for the first week? Will have no livestock and will be keeping the lighting to six or seven hours and starting on 50% power.
• Can/should I start dosing fertiliser from day 1? Plan is to split feed into daily dosing, so do I start straight away? I have read or heard somewhere – maybe GreenAqua? – not to feed for first two weeks.

Happy to hear views – particularly if I’m about to do something stupid. Or any suggestions on how to make it look better.

Will hopefully be planting in a week or two, so will update then.

Cheers

Mark

 

[Lauris]

• I know to do lots of water changes in the first few weeks. I have read daily in week 1, but could I do every other day for the first week? Will have no livestock and will be keeping the lighting to six or seven hours and starting on 50% power.
• Can/should I start dosing fertiliser from day 1? Plan is to split feed into daily dosing, so do I start straight away? I have read or heard somewhere – maybe GreenAqua? – not to feed for first two weeks.

I go for 3 times a week 30-40% if lean fertilising method or 4 times 50% if EI. But that's my approach.

Yes, fertilise from day one


That's a nice size tank and helluva piece of wood 👍

 

[Myrtle]

I love that look! Even if the wood does look like it's sticking two fingers up to the world 😆. Looking forward to seeing it planted.

 

[Karacticus]

I love that look! Even if the wood does look like it's sticking two fingers up to the world 😆. Looking forward to seeing it planted.

Ha, thanks! Hadn't spotted that 😅

 

[Karacticus]

Hi All

What are people's thoughts on planting compositions? I was thinking of trying to stick to maybe 10-12 different plant species - mix of positions - rather than go nuts and add them to the basket like sweets. Also, I want to go heavy on the planting, so any idea of how many pots I might need? One site suggests 48+ for my size tank - sounds like a lot!

I live in a hard water area - anything I need to avoid?

I also love Alternantheria 'Pink' but plan to keep plecos and shrimp - any alternatives to consider?

Thanks

Mark

 

[MichaelJ]

Also, I want to go heavy on the planting

Thats a good idea! The exact number of plants will obviously vary by type of plants and how big they are when you purchase them - 48 pots sounds a bit excessive for your 300 L tank given your hardscape footprint, but then again if you want to go dense from the get go, which most of us advice, you definitely need a lot... you can always start with a good potion of cheap faster growers and swap them out over time as the tank matures. Y

I live in a hard water area - anything I need to avoid?

Plants that specifically prefer soft water ... which are not that many btw. Easy plants and many medium plants will be fine in hard water. Also, depending on how hard the water actually is, you probably do not want to go too lean with your fertilizers - and make sure you pick a good fertilizer such as TNC Complete, Tropica Specialized or ATP. And, yes, fertilize from day one as mentioned above.

Cheers,
Michael

 

[Happi]

@Karacticus I assume you are planning on using this ?

 

[Karacticus]

Thats a good idea! The exact number of plants will obviously vary by type of plants and how big they are when you purchase them - 48 pots sounds a bit excessive for your 300 L tank given your hardscape footprint, but then again if you want to go dense from the get go, which most of us advice, you definitely need a lot... you can always start with a good potion of cheap faster growers and swap them out over time as the tank matures. Y


Plants that specifically prefer soft water ... which are not that many btw. Easy plants and many medium plants will be fine in hard water. Also, depending on how hard the water actually is, you probably do not want to go too lean with your fertilizers - and make sure you pick a good fertilizer such as TNC Complete, Tropica Specialized or ATP. And, yes, fertilize from day one as mentioned above.

Cheers,
Michael

Thanks, @MichaelJ. Much appreciated. I'll go a little smaller on the plant buying and see how it looks! I was planning on TNC Complete, but have been persuaded to try EI as below. Yes, was planning on a fair few stems and maybe some val, plus floating plants to get me through the initial set up and then, yes, tinker with planting after that.

@Karacticus I assume you are planning on using this ?

Hi @Happi. Yes, have got everything I need and some scientific scales - just need to mix it up! Was planning on a daily feed, so I assume I could go for a greater dilution to make dosing easier to handle?

 

[Happi]

Hi @Happi. Yes, have got everything I need and some scientific scales - just need to mix it up! Was planning on a daily feed, so I assume I could go for a greater dilution to make dosing easier to handle?

yes, try to make it so it last about 2 month or so. i wouldn't suggest making it for long term and recommend making the new batches every few months. let me know once you have it mixed up or need any help or verifying anything further, i will stay in touch.

 

[Karacticus]

Happy new aquascape day to me! So excited to finally get my tank planted up and flooded. It's been up and running for a few hours now. I keep nervously checking everything for leaks - the inline diffuser was leaking slightly, but have managed to tighten it up and it seems okay. Just testing the CO2 regulator for leaks, but that seems okay so am planning on getting those little bubbles flowing soon.

I originally told myself that I would keep to maybe ten or twelve plant species repeated, but I couldn't help myself. Have gone for largely South American species, where I could, but there were just too many plants I love from both sides of the world. And the aim is to love it, not create an accurate biotope for me. Stock list:

-Sagittaria natans x 1
-Rotala wallichi x 2

• Lysimachia nummuleria 'aurea' x 2
• Ludwigia palustrus x 1
• Ludwegia glandulosa x 1
• Hygrophila siamensis 53b x 1
• Limnophila heterophylla x 2
• Liaeopsis brasiliensis x 2
• Hygrophila angustifolia rubra x 1
• Hydrocotyle verticulata x 1
• Hydrocotyle leucocephala x 1
• Echinodorus spectra x 1
• E. sunset x 1
• E. parviflorus x 1
• E. midifleur x 1
• E. atlandsberg x 1
• Cryptocoryne wendtii x 1
• C. nevellii x 1
• Aponogeton madagascariensis x 1
• Anubias congensis x 1
• Anubias barteri 'Petite' x 1
• Anubia barteri 'Gold Coin' x 1

With hindsight, could have gone a bit heavier on the stems for the back of the tank, but will trim and replant as and when. I also figured that some plants might not do as well as others, so can always thin out later down the line. I also have some red root floaters en route and I really want a Nymphaea - was top of my list, but Aqua Essentials were out of stock, so will hold on for now.

I have set the temperature to 22 degrees - added dechlorinater and beneficial bacteria. Light set at 40% power with a seven hour photoperiod (30 min ramp either end).

My only gripe is the black vinyl at the back, which has developed bubbles where it was rolled up. Annoying, but hopefully be well covered eventually.

The Biomaster keeps discharging bubbles every few minutes. I understand this is normal? Doesn't really bother me, unless it is a fault.

Overall, really pleased with how it has gone. Hopefully look better once the water clears and the plants start to kick in!

 

[Karacticus]

Meant to add photos, obviously...

 

[Happi]

Meant to add photos, obviously...

considering the plant and the plant mass, i think you should target 1 ppm N weekly split into smaller doses, either 3x or 6x a week. its up to you.
thread linked to your dosing.

the plant mass appear quite low to my standard and you are likely to face many algae problems in the early stages regardless of whatever you dose. I usually advice lot of floating plant, well as fast growing stems.

 

[Karacticus]

considering the plant and the plant mass, i think you should target 1 ppm N weekly split into smaller doses, either 3x or 6x a week. its up to you.
thread linked to your dosing.

the plant mass appear quite low to my standard and you are likely to face many algae problems in the early stages regardless of whatever you dose. I usually advice lot of floating plant, well as fast growing stems.

Thanks, @Happi. I thought the stem plants would go further, so I might order some more to bulk them out a bit. I have mixed up my fertiliser, so will start with 1ppm N weekly for now. I'll update my journal with progress. Really appreciate your help - and everyone else's.

 

[Happi]

Thanks, @Happi. I thought the stem plants would go further, so I might order some more to bulk them out a bit. I have mixed up my fertiliser, so will start with 1ppm N weekly for now. I'll update my journal with progress. Really appreciate your help - and everyone else's.

can you put this Information regarding how much you mixed, which chemicals you have used in your main post ? including all other detail about the water parameter and such? in #1
it is easy to loose track of things.

 

[Karacticus]

can you put this Information regarding how much you mixed, which chemicals you have used in your main post ? including all other detail about the water parameter and such? in #1
it is easy to loose track of things.

Sure. I am still getting to grips with measurements and, to be honest, I have little confidence in the digital pH and hardness metre. It can't get the temperature right, so not sure how accurate it is. I have attached my water quality chart.

Yesterday evening:

7.35 pH
TDS 335ppm

Today:

90% water change
7.45 pH
TDS 361

Fertiliser:

For my first run, I have decided to dose macros and micros separately, as follows:

1. Solufeed 2:1:4 500ml solution, containing 31.545g of Solufeed 2:1:4, 9ml of white vinegar and the rest distilled water. Dosing 30ml, split x3 (10ml on Sunday, Tuesday and Thursday).

2. Solufeed Sodium Free TEC 500ml solution, containing 5.721g of Solufeed Sodium Free TEC, 9ml and vinegar and the rest distilled water. Dosing 30ml, split x 3 (10ml on Monday, Wednesday and Friday).

I am going to run with this regime for now (unless someone says will cause major damage) despite frequent water changes this week.

Oase Biomaster Thermo:

The constant burping this thing does is kind of annoying. It is doing it every minute or two, leaving quite a lot of microbubbles everywhere. I have seen this might be a flow rate issue of it sucking too hard and drawing air through the seals of the canister itself. Have seen some potential remedies of Vaseline around the seals and drilling additional holes in the pre-filter tube. Think I will try this if it continues.

 

[Karacticus]

So, I am trying to get my CO2 dialled in to the correct level, so any advice appreciated.

I am running at around 2-3 bubbles per second, coming on two hours before lights up. I am getting a pH drop, but not as much as I expected. The photos are from 8am before lights and CO2 (definite blue colour - 7.74pH), midday (two hours of CO2 and lights up - turquoisey - 7.52pH) and 5pm (deep green but not lime green - 7.32pH). Should I up the CO2 a tad?

Some plants, like the Limnophila and Echindorus are already showing signs of new growth, which is exciting!

 

[hypnogogia]

Should I up the CO2 a tad?

Yes. Ideally you are looking for a 1pH drop.

 

[John q]

Hiya @Karacticus

Yes I would imagine the co2 rate needs increasing, admittedly bubble rates aren't an accurate way of measuring the gas that's going into the tank but I'd be surprised if 2 - 3 per second is enough for a 300L tank.

The ph drop generally isn't a linear affair, it tends to drop quickly to begin with then slowly tapers off. In the fist hour I can drop the ph by about 0.5, but it then takes another 2.5 hrs to complete the final 0.5.

With the above in mind your ph drop after two hours is only 0.22, this then drops a further 0.2 over the next 5hrs.

My advice would be to increase the bubble rate by one and note the ph after 1hr of gas, then 2hrs etc until the ph levels out as the lights come on and remains stable throughout the photo period, it might start to drop towards the back end of the photo period, but that's normal.

I'd say on a tank that size you'd be looking for a minimum of a .5 drop in the first hour and then it could take another couple of hours (this would mean having the gas on earlier) before you hit the 1 point drop, assuming of course you are aiming for a 1 point drop?

Obviously if you do up the injection rate make sure you are on hand all day to watch the fish for abnormal behaviour and to check the ph levels for future reference.

Last but not least is the 7.74 ph fully degassed, I suspect its not far off but thought I'd better ask.

 

[Karacticus]

Hiya @Karacticus

Yes I would imagine the co2 rate needs increasing, admittedly bubble rates aren't an accurate way of measuring the gas that's going into the tank but I'd be surprised if 2 - 3 per second is enough for a 300L tank.

The ph drop generally isn't a linear affair, it tends to drop quickly to begin with then slowly tapers off. In the fist hour I can drop the ph by about 0.5, but it then takes another 2.5 hrs to complete the final 0.5.

With the above in mind your ph drop after two hours is only 0.22, this then drops a further 0.2 over the next 5hrs.

My advice would be to increase the bubble rate by one and note the ph after 1hr of gas, then 2hrs etc until the ph levels out as the lights come on and remains stable throughout the photo period, it might start to drop towards the back end of the photo period, but that's normal.

I'd say on a tank that size you'd be looking for a minimum of a .5 drop in the first hour and then it could take another couple of hours (this would mean having the gas on earlier) before you hit the 1 point drop, assuming of course you are aiming for a 1 point drop?

Obviously if you do up the injection rate make sure you are on hand all day to watch the fish for abnormal behaviour and to check the ph levels for future reference.

Last but not least is the 7.74 ph fully degassed, I suspect its not far off but thought I'd better ask.

Thanks, @John q . That's really helpful and makes sense. I upped the bubble rate yesterday afternoon, so will see how it looks when I get home later. I'm out most days, so will check in this evening and keep in view until the weekend when I can take better readings throughout the day. I'm a little way off getting livestock, so hopefully have it dialled in before then, but the point is taken.

And, yes, the 7.74pH was first thing in the morning before CO2 came on. Similar this morning.

Thanks again!

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

The ph drop generally isn't a linear affair, it tends to drop quickly to begin with then slowly tapers off. In the fist hour I can drop the ph by about 0.5, but it then takes another 2.5 hrs to complete the final 0.5.

I'm not a CO2 user, but I think that the <"relationship between time and pH drop isn't linear"> because of the <"log base 10 nature of the pH scale">.

cheers Darrel