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Re-scaping my 200l tank

H

hudsonpd

Member
Joined
17 Jul 2011
Messages
114
Right, having scattered random questions over the forum, I have decided I'm going to re-scape my current tank! In another forum I asked about emptying it and starting again, but I've decided that all I really need to do is re-consider the plant stocks and where I put them. So I'm going to up root some current ones and re-plant old ones. Overall, I'll stock a higher level of plants than before.

for background, my tank is a 1m long by 55cm deep and about 40cm wide. Its about 18 months old now and I've been through several (all of the usual) issues :) So now I'm going to (hopefully) put it all into practice.

Several months ago I swapped the filter for an over-sized Fluval FX5 and over this last weekend I have made my first attempt at a spray bar, which works ok but not 100% perfect yet!

I have rather a lot of lighting - 4 Grobeams, which I calculated with some help of a great American website but it turns out to be very bright! So a couple of months ago I invested in a TMC 8-way controller and now have the lights on at about 40%!

Co2 injection is inline UP atomiser, which I added about a year ago, when I swapped to the Fluval FX5.

Even with the spray bar, I expect a couple of parts of the tank still won't get great flow when I've re-planted because of the layout and planting mass. However, I'm hoping that the mid ground plants will block out un-seemly stems and the tops will still get plenty of flow.

I'll post the current pics tonight and also try and upload my new planting plan to hopefully get some ideas about planting arrangements. I'm planning to shopping for new plants at the wkd!

Paul
 
OK, here is my planned layout. This is the plan as seen from the top. The hardscape is pretty much there already. The brown in the middle is the bogwood. The grey are stones and the two other shapes are caves/flowerpots for Apistos.

What do you think? Does the plant composition look good? Any suggestions for improvements or different plants?

I'm unsure whether the flow will work at the back left because of the hardscape and bogwood affecting flow. Remember it s spray bar across the back wall.

Tanklayout.jpg
 
Hi Paul, well that's a lot of plants and a lot of different species! You will struggle to make a cohesive layout with all those different textures and leaf shapes, i'm guilty of doing the same thing myself. The desire to grow "everything" is one that must be mastered. For instance, growing Glosso on one side then HC on the other will look rather odd, the same for Eleocharis and Lileaopsis. I think you could half the number of species and have a much better layout. Try and stick to fairly similar leaf shapes, NOT Ludwigia repens next to Pogostemon erectus etc....

I hope this helps....
 
Hi Dan,

Thanks for your advice. I think I am struggling to master that element - especially for foreground plants!

I am also struggling to understand how to balance 'grouping plants with similar leaf structures' vs 'contrasts of colours/textures'. Your comment about Repens for example - I was trying to creating a contrast between colour and texture there. Is it better to group plants by leaf for example and then select 2/3 specific areas for contrasts?

Thanks
Paul
 
Hi Foxfish, I fitted the UP atomiser by using using a DIY piping arrangement with a 'y' splitter, splitting the flow across two pipes - one with the 16/22 pipe and the UP in that side. The other with 25/32 pipe. Then a 'y' splitter brings them back together and into the Fluval pipe.

And now I have added my own Acrylic spray bar to that!
 
I honestly think we should create our own styles, I understand what dan is saying, yes u need to have an understanding about what works where but I also believe the point of Aquascaping is to not follow rules, were only going to all end up with the same thing. I think the fact is trail and error is of the best success.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2
 
So this weekend, I go around to buying some new plants and re-scaping a little. I took a shot beforehand of the tank - warts and all! - and have posted it below. The tank has looked better at various points over the previous 18 months, but this is it immediately before I re-did it. You will notice how large the Anubias had become and the remnants of various BBA outbreaks I have had on its leaves!

The Hygrophilia at the back has also got a little stringy and unkempt.

Fishtankrescape002.jpg
 
So I took out the Anubias and the Java Fern - and how surprised I was to see how large each had become! In taking it out I wrecked the layout as the wood came out too! The roots were so well engrained on the wood they both took some removing!

I removed various other plants and moved the hair grass from the front right. By the time I had removed and moved stuff I had made quite a mess and had begun to wish I'd just started over!

Anyway, I did a 50% water change too and bought new plants from a local show. After about 4 hours I'd got it back looking ship-shape, but a bit different. So the shot below is how it looks now. The plants at the back left haven't been planted in yet, they are still in their pots and weights. I'm just trying to work out the best layout for them. Its obvious they need to grow quite a bit and I also need quite a few more to fill in at the back left too.

Down at the front I've planted 4 pots of HC - fingers crossed they get chance to take root before the shrimps and Corys have them out! I've followed the advice on here to cut the rockwool up and make 9 little plugs from each pot. I've also planted two new pots of Hair Grass. So, from the plan, I've simplified a little following Dan's advice and not used Glosso and the Lilaeopsis Brasiliensis.

At the back I think (not sure exactly as some weren't labelled) I've got a Rotala Wallichii log leaf, rotala macrandra and maybe Postagram and also two other varieties of Hygrophilia, I think.

Fishtankrescape005.jpg
 
Looks nice so far, will look great when grown in more. The good side of having lots of species is that you can find out which ones work the best and remove the ones that dont. What have you done with the big anubias and java fern ?
 
Thanks for your comments. I was going to throw the big anubias and fern away as i dont know any people locally who'd want them.
 
A fee days in and no major algae bloom as id feared - yet!

This might be a silly question but is there any need to plant all of the stem plants at the back left? I mean, ive left them like that for now so that i can re arrange to find the best balance, but could i leave them permanently like that? Then i can remove and change them as i want further down the line? Anyone else done that?
 
Watch out the algae will come. It took about 3-4 weeks to appear but now I have it and I'm keeping a close eye on it, as well as using the ADA Phyton Git product which keeps things it in shape.

I'd leave your plants as they are and let them settle in, and then see how they develop. things are looking good so far.

It must be a packed hood with 4 Growbeams in there!
 
If you keep everything balanced and use a low level of light then you can easily get away without having algae. Floating plants work great for this as they lower lighting levels but then again you are using growbeams so you can just reduce the intensity. Regarding the stem plants you could put them wherever you want now or just let them grow for a bit and plant the trimmings. I try to fill all the empty spaces with stem plants as I like dense jungle style tanks and it allows more room for growth but its totally up to you. Also if your really worried about algae then get some fast growing plants to fill the gaps then get sell them after.
I have PM'ed you about the anubias btw.
 
Thanks everyone for their replies.

On reading my last post again, I think I confused you with my question! I was trying to ask (not very clearly!) whether anyone has ever left their stem plants at the back with the weights on and in their pots? I left them like this so that I could easily move them around to try different things and to make the display easier and now wonder whether I can just leave them like this for the future? Will the lead become a problem in the water?

The plants all seem to be growing nicely although about half of the HC has come up (as always!) but fingers crossed for the remaining bits! I'm not as hopeful as I was because I just read PFK and George was saying that pea gravel isn't good to grow it in! I've got Tetra plant substrate underneath the gravel and when I planted the HC I've put some soil based complete around them too to try and keep them in place, so I'm hoping they will both be enough to give the roots some relief!
 
OK, so its been a few weeks now and no sign of algae but I think I'm going to need some help getting some of these plants to grow!

No algae bloom as expected and the hygrophilia plants and the Bacopa are going well but the other news ones I added seem to show new sprouts at the top but then after a couple of weeks the lower leaves all 'melt' away and also the bottoms seem to turn black, rot and then float to the top! I thought it was just one, but the red plant in the photo earlier has just started doing the same. Some of the Hyrophilia at the back that has grown also shows some signs of spots on the leaves.

The grobeams were at just 30% light using the the controller, recently I upped this to 40%. Still dosing ferts every day and the flow is soooo much better with the back spray bar. The CO2 is also looking good, showing lime green at the bottom back. I upped it slightly recently.

btw all of the HC either melted or just floated out! so thats all 4 pots wasted!

Beginning to get frustrated again! Not from algae this time but from lack of plant growth.

Will try to get some pics again soon.
 
Hello,

hudsonpd said:
The grobeams were at just 30% light using the the controller, recently I upped this to 40%
Click to expand...
This contributes to plants melting. You should reduce this and add more CO2. You can also supplement the CO2 with any of the liquid carbon products.

Cheers,
 
ceg4048 said:
This contributes to plants melting. You should reduce this and add more CO2. You can also supplement the CO2 with any of the liquid carbon products.
Click to expand...

Clive can you elaborate on the theory and practice of supplementing with liquid carbon... the pros, cons, caveats (certain plants not liking it for example) ? I have been aware that some people use both methods but have, up till now, been concerned about overdosing (or even knowing how to dose). Cheers.
 
Well there's very little theory involved. Adding more CO2 increases plant growth rates and plant health. Since, for our purposes, inside the plant tissue, liquid carbon => CO2, then adding liquid carbon at the same time as adding gaseous CO2 means that there is more available CO2 for the plant. The two compounds do not compete with each other, i.e adding liquid carbon does not prevent the plants from using the gas, and vice-versa.

So, it can easily be (and happens quite often) that due to the sensitivity of the fish or shrimp in that particular tank, as well as due to other factors, such as poor flow/distribution, too much light etc., the hobbyist finds that the gas injection rate is at a maximum permissible level with respect to toxicity, yet the tank still suffers CO2 related algae. Supplementing liquid carbon simply adds more CO2 while avoiding crossing of the gas toxicity threshold.

Of course, there are three main limitations:
1. The liquid only delivers a fraction of the amount of CO2 that the gas delivers.
2. Liquid carbon has toxicity issues of it's own.
3. Liquid Carbon is much more expensive than gas.

So liquid carbon is no panacea, but it is simply a tool that raises the available CO2 levels, while having some algaecidal properties. These products can be used at whatever non-toxic levels desired. I don't have an exhaustive list of plants that react negatively, the most reported being Riccia, Elodea and Vallis. However, toxicity is based on concentration level, not just the presence of gluteraldehyde. So that's why some people will report that their Vallis, dies while others will report that Vallis thrives with the addition of liquid carbon. Just about all carpet plants, mosses, ferns, crypts, swords and most stems do fine.

A starting dose, assuming none of the low tolerance species are in the tank can be a daily dose at the beginning of the photoperiod of the suggestion on the bottle, but, depending on the fish/shrimp in the tank this can be exceeded, or it may need to be dosed at a lower level. It's also important to note that this should be a DAILY dosing, otherwise this can sometimes equate to poor CO2 stability, which can cause other problems.

There are quite a few people dosing liquid carbon only so it would be better to search for those threads or search using the name of the plant/fish with "carbon", Excel" and so forth to see what others experience.

Cheers,
 
Thanks Clive

ive just changed the lighting back down to 30% but I put it at 40% because I thought the red plant and others were high light loving and would need more light to bring out the red and encourage their growth? Am i wrong?

or will the 30% light with plenty of co2 be enough?

i was also worried about just increasing co2 might harm the fish as the drop checker is on lime green already! Admittedly I'm not sure it's quite right when the lights go on but it's hard to tell. The co2 does start more than 2 hours before.

There is still no real algae to speak of but the plants aren't growing well. They certainly don't look like they did on the photo earlier! Except that is for the 'easier' crypts and hygrophilia.

i also think my filter needs cleaning out though as I'm getting what can only be described as 'micro dirt' gathering on the leaves - doesn't look like algae more like dirt.....but I may be wrong. I will clean this wkd and drop the light and see how it fares next week
P
 
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