Reef to River.

[seedoubleyou]

So I’ve closed down my reef tank and want to reinvent it, I love freshwater planted aquariums and can’t wait to get back into this side of the hobby after scratching my marine itch.

This tank is going to be a slow burner with me carefully considering each step, this is for two reasons 1. To practice some patience (something I’m usually terrible at) 2. To ensure I get this right and create something I’m happy with.

My initial thoughts were, epiphytes only covering the expanse of my rockwork and giving it somewhat of a reef tank appearance. Call it the best of both worlds.

But this has got me thinking. How far can I push this tank?

The rockwork is new and made from ceramic, it was purchased for a reef that i decided not to follow through with, so I’m aiming to re-purpose.

The tank is 90 x 53 x 55cm (or close too off the top of my head). Around 200L.

Filtered by an Oase biomaster 600 thermo.
Lighting 2 x Reef LED 50w (I’ll see how they do)
Sand is regular aquarium sand (not aragonite or crushed coral)

I do plan Co2 injection, I just need to purchase an @CO2Art.co.uk regulator and in-line diffuser.

Initial pics below, unsure on fish stocking just yet. And heavily debating carpeting plants with some crypts and styrogyne repens around the base.
Any thoughts? On plants? Fish? How you would approach this?

Many thanks,
Chris.

 

[mort]

With the rockwork you could do an almost bonsai inspired tank. There are lots of examples on Google.

Fish wise, a simple large school of something would look good but a high bodied tetra like black phantoms, would make a nice choice considering the height of the tank.

 

[Mr.Shenanagins]

A mixture of different colored bucephelandra would be pretty awesome I think, just remember that’s going to cost a pretty penny to cover those rocks. As a prior reefer I’m sure that’s not so much a surprise or issue for you. In addition, I’d run your lights at prob 30-40% of their power, along with CO2 injection to avoid any algae issues.

 

[seedoubleyou]

Appreciate both sets of advice.
You’re not wrong about money being no issue and I’m fully prepared for it to cost several hundred pounds to cover this in epiphytes. (Trust me, it’s a welcome change)

@mort i think you’re right on a small single species for this tank. I can certainly always add to it later if I feel it’s missing a centrepiece.

I’ll give bonsai a look, I’m familiar with this style of reef keeping but not freshwater.

 

[shangman]

I think this is a cool plan! here's some ideas for it, and what I would do if I had this setup in case that helps.

If it was me I would do a dry start with this rock, and cover it in moss so it goes entirely green. A dry start is where you buy some moss, whiz it up in food processor with some yoghurt and paint it onto your hardscape, then put it in the tank for 3 weeks with no water, but a lid to keep humidity in. There are some youtube tutorials on it. This allows the moss to attach to the hardscape, so that when you flood the aquarium with water it stays stuck and grows in a thick even layer.

I would attach lots of nice java fern, bolbitis, anubias and buces to the rock. And behind the rock I would plant some tall grassy plants to add a dramatic background, like eleocharis, vallis nana, crypt balansae to add height and another texture. You might also include some lower background plants and make it fully lush, and bring in some other colours so it's not all very green, maybe using other crypts, lilies or echinodorus. In that case you will need a deeper substrate, ideally with some soil under your sand. Around the base of the rocks at the sides and back I'd add some crypts to add lushness and habitat for fish to hide in, and add some more colour, though you could keep it more of an "island" style scape and ignore that. In the front amongst the stones and coming out from them I'd grow some small crypts like hobbit or parva, along with some small grass like eleocharis mini.

The colours would end up more varied than this green, this is just a quick sketch to give an idea. I would also add some small twiggy bits of wood to give the impression of roots growing down which would make it look more natural, as well as use botanicals and dried leaves on the sand to add more good fish habitat and food.

​

 

[seedoubleyou]

I think this is a cool plan! here's some ideas for it, and what I would do if I had this setup in case that helps.

If it was me I would do a dry start with this rock, and cover it in moss so it goes entirely green. A dry start is where you buy some moss, whiz it up in food processor with some yoghurt and paint it onto your hardscape, then put it in the tank for 3 weeks with no water, but a lid to keep humidity in. There are some youtube tutorials on it. This allows the moss to attach to the hardscape, so that when you flood the aquarium with water it stays stuck and grows in a thick even layer.

I would attach lots of nice java fern, bolbitis, anubias and buces to the rock. And behind the rock I would plant some tall grassy plants to add a dramatic background, like eleocharis, vallis nana, crypt balansae to add height and another texture. You might also include some lower background plants and make it fully lush, and bring in some other colours so it's not all very green, maybe using other crypts, lilies or echinodorus. In that case you will need a deeper substrate, ideally with some soil under your sand. Around the base of the rocks at the sides and back I'd add some crypts to add lushness and habitat for fish to hide in, and add some more colour, though you could keep it more of an "island" style scape and ignore that. In the front amongst the stones and coming out from them I'd grow some small crypts like hobbit or parva, along with some small grass like eleocharis mini.

The colours would end up more varied than this green, this is just a quick sketch to give an idea. I would also add some small twiggy bits of wood to give the impression of roots growing down which would make it look more natural, as well as use botanicals and dried leaves on the sand to add more good fish habitat and food.

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Wow I absolutely love this plan. That sketch you knocked up is incredible mate, thank you so much for taking that kind of time.

I think I really like that idea, and you’ve clearly got an eye for design.

 

[seedoubleyou]

So going from the above, planting plan so far will look something like;

Background: Vallisneria Nana, Crypt Crynum or Balansae, Eleocharis for another texture maybe. (Will plant all and see what works)

On the hardscape: Moss (likely Taxiphyllum Barbieri), Bolbitis, Ferns (needle leaf, trident, regular java), Bucephalandra, Anubias (maybe).

Around the hard scape: various coloured crypts.

Foreground (branching off the hardscape): Crypt Hobbit, Crypt Parva and Eleocharis Mini (Will plant all 3 and remove what doesn’t work)


Substrate: I will likely go for ADA products, I have identified the following and will research each one more; ADA Amazonia Version 2, Power sand advance, Bacter 100, Clear super, Tourmaline BC.
This will then likely be capped in La Plata sand (or an alternative)

I also really like the idea of adding offshoots of branches and twigs, I think that will really add a sense of time and nature to the tank.

Fish stocking:
Celestial Pearl Danio + Danio Tinwini.
(Unless something more suitable to the end product comes about later on)

CUC:
Initial plan is Horned nerites, Amano shrimp and Ottocinclus (standard clean up crew really)

Thanks again to everyone who has read and contributed to my journal this far, it’s greatly appreciated to take advice and inspiration from others.

Regards,
Chris.

 

[john6]

Looking forward to seeing this develop.

 

[shangman]

Wow I absolutely love this plan. That sketch you knocked up is incredible mate, thank you so much for taking that kind of time.

I think I really like that idea, and you’ve clearly got an eye for design.

Oh that's great, glad to have helped! I think your idea of using the rocks is a really good one and looking forward to seeing what you do with it. I always like making plans like this, though I always find a few extra plants I really like to squeeze in too that don't fit but... damnit, I want them! Also a good idea to research what fish you want to keep and what requirements they might have that need to be designed into the scape.

Background: Vallisneria Nana, Crypt Crynum or Balansae, Eleocharis for another texture maybe. (Will plant all and see what works)

Sounds v good. I think looking at ADA scapes is a good way to work out which of these kinds of plants is your favourite, Amano often used a long thin grass "curtain" at the back of the tank which does always look good. Crinum are really lovely plants.

Other good plants like this are Eleocharis vivipara and Cyperus helferi

On the hardscape: Moss (not sure on species yet, I’ll research which works best), Bolbitis, Ferns (needle leaf, trident, regular java), Bucephalandra, Anubias (maybe).

For mosses there are quite a few options including phoenix moss, willow moss, mini christmas moss, riccardia chamedryfolia. If you want a nice tight look that forms little cushions then riccardia chamedryfolia is probably your best option, it doesn't really need to be trimmed much, though I think you have to buy it from other users rather than at shops for some reason. Willow & Mini Christmas moss do need trimming sometimes. Phoenix moss is also very nice, one of my favs, it does need trimming sometimes but I find it grows easier than some other mosses.

If you go to Wildwoods World of Water for plants at some point they often sell some more unsual ferns, anubias and other epiphytes to mix in with your classics like java fern trident and bolbitis. I would go there are Aquarium Gardens for plants, they are both top notch. It's also often good to post in the For Sale subforum for things like bolbitis and trident java fern since these plants grow really well for some people, and from experience you get better plants and portions from other UKAPS members.

Around the hard scape: various coloured crypts.

Very nice I love a lovely crypt and the colour they add, you also could consider some mid-height grassy plants like Helanthium tenellum, Eleocharis Acicularis (the not mini version), or Blyxa Japonica (this one definitely needs CO2). These plants could be a nice transition between the superlong grass at the back and the mini at the front.

Foreground (branching off the hardscape): Crypt Hobbit, Crypt Parva and Eleocharis Mini (Will plant all 3 and remove what doesn’t work)

Sounds great, a mixed carpet I think looks really nice and a bit more natural. Another one I forgot to mention that's my new favourite is Lilaeopsis Brasiliensis which has a very natural tiny leaf shape and mixes great with the eleocharis mini.

Looking forward to seeing what way you go! Hope the videos and advice are useful

 

[Courtneybst]

That sketch is incredible! @shangman

Also love this take @seedoubleyou
I really like when people do things different and push the boundaries. Following with great intrigue!

 

[Courtneybst]

Vallisneria Nana

You could even go Cyperus Helferi if you want a very similar affect without having to deal with the wildness of vallisneria. It gets out of control so easily!

 

[seedoubleyou]

All this advice and interest has got me very excited for this project.
Some great plants to consider.

I think in terms of fish stocking, I’ve always loved celestial Pearl danios (galaxy rasbora). They’re a strong contender at the minute and they’ll appreciate cooler waters, which I’m lead to believe helps in algae mitigation.

I’ve always wanted to keep a larger group of these fish than I have previously been able too so we’ll see.

Admittedly the aquascape will come first and foremost, I’ll then add a complementary fish species (taking into consider their requirements also).

I feel the Celestial Pearl danio will add a real sense of life to the Aquascape with their sparring and darting in and out of the plants. Almost adding a sense that life just goes on when what was once a stone structure is now overrun with nature.

 

[Conort2]

think in terms of fish stocking, I’ve always loved celestial Pearl danios (galaxy rasbora).

Good choice but I’d go with another more active fish alongside them. Cpd are beautiful fish but they’re tiny and quite secretive.

I’d go with danio tinwini, Vietnamese or standard white cloud minnows or something like chela. These are all small fish which like cooler water but will be on show all the time.

Cheers

 

[seedoubleyou]

Good choice but I’d go with another more active fish alongside them. Cpd are beautiful fish but they’re tiny and quite secretive.

I’d go with danio tinwini, Vietnamese or standard white cloud minnows or something like chela. These are all small fish which like cooler water but will be on show all the time.

Cheers

The Tinwini is a very pretty little fish, I’d be intrigued to know if it could co-habit with the celestial?
Edit: some lite research and they should be fine Co-habbiting.

 

[Conort2]

The Tinwini is a very pretty little fish, I’d be intrigued to know if it could co-habit with the celestial?
Edit: some lite research and they should be fine Co-habbiting.

Yes they’re perfect tank mates. Basically exactly the same requirements as each other but one species hangs in the top half of the aquarium and the other the bottom.

Forgot to add, the pictures online don’t do them justice!

 

[seedoubleyou]

Yes they’re perfect tank mates. Basically exactly the same requirements as each other but one species hangs in the top half of the aquarium and the other the bottom.

Forgot to add, the pictures online don’t do them justice!

If they get any better than online mate they’re definitely on the list. Stunning little fish and I like the way the spots will tie in with each other.

 

[Djoko Sauza]

I think some broad leaf Anubias, such as Hastifolia, would look great and different than the usual overused epyphites.

For the background there is also Eleocharis Montevidensis, tall like the Vivipara but without the offshoots.

 

[seedoubleyou]

Very cluttered. But here’s a quick planting plan for the tank. @shangman has really helped give the tank a great direction and I’m really excited to try and execute on the above plan.

I’m in the process of moving home so it will be a little while before this thing gets anything added to it unfortunately.
But that gives me more time to really nail the details and planting arrangements.

I’m set on my fish selection of separate danio species both staying below 3cm in size. I’ll likely stick between 10-15 of each fish.

I may go for the dry start method on this with the moss, and will try the soil version rather than yoghurt. But still undecided.

Thanks again to everyone who’s commented so far and offered advice, feedback and suggestions.

This tank would be boring without you all.

 

[seedoubleyou]

The above is general arrangement, plants will be planted according to what looks most natural with plants appearing in more than one area.

 

[Djoko Sauza]

Looking good. Are you planning on using Fissidens as your only moss?

As it looks like you'll want a mossy scape, you can look into making moss balls (not the cladophora algae balls, "real" moss balls). Basically bind/glue any kind of moss you like on a small stone or slate chip. Once grown in it looks very natural. I like that they give you a lot of options and flexibility later on since you can just move them where you need to.

A couple more things:
Dwarf Hairgrass will send runners in all directions and eventually carpet the whole area. Keeping it tidy will be pretty much impossible, unless you want to spend considerable time and effort keeping it contained.

And lastly Bolbitis grows large, with leaves easily reaching over 10cm. I love me some Bolbitis but I thought you should know!

I think the bronze and red hues in the crypts will look amazing amongst all the greenery by the way.