Suggest a small bushy plant for bogwood . . .

Wookii

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Sorry guys, another plant query . . .

Having set up the hardscape in my son's new tank, we have a fair bit of bog wood that I'd like to cover with plants. We've picked out places where we intend to add some Anubias Petite and Anubias Pangolino, along with others where we plan to add some mosses (Java, Fissidens and Christmas).

However in the central area where the bogwood 'roots' converge, I want to add some small plants, that grow in the region of 2-3 inches at most (or can be reasonably trimmed to maintain that height), but grow fairly bushy to fill the voids, and hide joints in the bog wood. Whatever plant we choose needs to readily grow on bogwood and rock.

I was hoping for a dwarf java fern or similar, but they appear to grow to 5 inches at minimum. One other possibility is Bolditis Heudelotii - assuming it can be trimmed to keep it low) -0 though I have read that it doesn't do too well under higher light, and its position will be closer to the surface in this tank.

I'd welcome any other suggestions anyone has?
 
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Tim Harrison

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Maybe some buces would do the job, take a look at Aquarium Gardens.
B. heudelotii, will grow too big and no amount of trimming will keep it small and compact, and it's a complete thug with CO2.
 

Wookii

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Or Lagenandra meeboldii, its as Buce also in the Araceae family and can grow epiphytic.
https://tropica.com/en/plants/plantdetails/Lagenandrameeboldii'Red'(103)/4759

But for all (Slow-Growing aquatic) epiphytes high light requires ample CO²
Thanks for the suggestion, but I suspect that will be far too big if the leaves are 4-6cm wide an 6-12cm long per that Tropica description. The tank is only 60cm long, so I'm intentionally sticking to small leaves plants to try and maintain a larger relative scale of everything in the tank.
 

dw1305

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Hi all,
B. heudelotii, will grow too big and no amount of trimming will keep it small and compact, and it's a complete thug with CO2.
It is a <"bigger plant and faster grower"> than people give it credit for, even low nutrient, low tech.
Bolditis Heudelotii mini
I have some of this that @frothhelmet sent me years ago. Similar in leaf, but a lot smaller.
I want to add some small plants, that grow in the region of 2-3 inches at most (or can be reasonably trimmed to maintain that height), but grow fairly bushy to fill the voids, and hide joints in the bog wood.
What about another moss or liverwort? or something like Lomariopsis lineata? Have a look at @X3NiTH's & @zozo's post <"Microsorum pteropus "seeds"">.

cheers Darrel
 

Wookii

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Hi all, It is a <"bigger plant and faster grower"> than people give it credit for, even low nutrient, low tech. I have some of this that @frothhelmet sent me years ago. Similar in leaf, but a lot smaller.What about another moss or liverwort? or something like Lomariopsis lineata? Have a look at @X3NiTH's & @zozo's post <"Microsorum pteropus "seeds"">.

cheers Darrel
Thanks Darrell. More moss is one option I'm considering. I could just let something like the Christmas Moss just grow out and plump up more fully to fill the space, so that's certainly a plan B. The Lomariopsis lineata looks interesting - I haven't seen that before - though from a quick read it mentions that it propagates via spores - I wouldn't want to risk it spreading all around the tank. is that likely?
 

dw1305

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Hi all,
Lomariopsis lineata looks interesting.........I wouldn't want to risk it spreading all around the tank. is that likely?
I think it probably is, but mainly from fragments of the "leaf" (prothalli), rather than spores.

I look on self-propagated new plants as "plants for free", growing somewhere they are happy, but I know that every-one doesn't have the same positive outlook.

cheers Darrel
 

zozo

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The Lomariopsis lineata looks interesting - I haven't seen that before - though from a quick read it mentions that it propagates via spores - I wouldn't want to risk it spreading all around the tank. is that likely?
I'm growing this for years now and it's very easy to maintain. It attaches really good and as a free centrepiece, it can grow into a nice group as big as a tennis ball. Tho it's brittle and also easily breaks off.

Here it is at the left growing on that DW tripod in the substrate.
dscf8052-kopie-jpg.jpg


A few months later triple in size.. At one point i wasn't paying attention and i ripped it off with syphoning :oops:
dscf9377-jpg.jpg


And that was the end.. This is a few years back in 2016.. I still have this tank and its still growing Lomariopsis lineata. I have no issues with it spreading uncontrollably.

This plant is often sold as Round Pelia Moss, but it isn't.. Tho it resambles Pelia Liver moss sp. Pelia and other livermosses grow in the same fashion in aquatic form tho a bit less rounded and forked. For the rest its the same, i also have no issues with this spreading around. Its stays rather put. I'm currently growing a similar ball from pelia sp. in this tank.

But than again, that's not difficult in a 110L tank with 150L/h turnover. Its about stagnant. :)
 
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Wookii

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I'm growing this for years now and it's very easy to maintain. It attaches really good and as a free centrepiece, it can grow into a nice group as big as a tennis ball. Tho it's brittle and also easily breaks off.

Here it is at the left growing on that DW tripod in the substrate.
dscf8052-kopie-jpg.jpg


A few months later triple in size.. At one point i wasn't paying attention and i ripped it off with syphoning :oops:
dscf9377-jpg.jpg


And that was the end.. This is a few years back in 2016.. I still have this tank and its still growing Lomariopsis lineata. I have no issues with it spreading uncontrollably.

This plant is often sold as Round Pelia Moss, but it isn't.. Tho it resambles Pelia Liver moss sp. Pelia and other livermosses grow in the same fashion in aquatic form tho a bit less rounded and forked. For the rest its the same, i also have no issues with this spreading around. Its stays rather put. I'm currently growing a similar ball from pelia sp. in this tank.

But than again, that's not difficult in a 110L tank with 150L/h turnover. Its about stagnant. :)
Thanks, that's really interesting - and good to know my concerns about it spreading are unfounded. It's really surprising to read that it is brittle, it looks really soft - almost gelatinous leaves - in some of the images I've seen; or does it have some sort of rhizome that is brittle? How do you go about pruning it - do you cut the leaves directly, or do you have to get down to the base to thin it out?

The other slight issue, is finding somewhere to buy it from. Google seems to bring up a similar looking plant referred to as Süßwassertang (German) is this the same plant? Referred to in this video:


It looks like the only source is some sellers on FleaBay if this is the same plant? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/143292249752

Edit - One other thing, can this be attached to rock/wood with glue, as I'm going to struggle tying it on where it is to be positioned - the other option would be to tie it to a small stone or wood off-cut and glue that in place, but I'd rather attach directly if possible.
 
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zozo

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It doesn't have a rhizome, it's a fern prothallium. If you look at the fern life cycle it's actually the first stage after the spore, that have a male and a female part. In Terrestrial form, raindrops splash the sperm from the male onto the female then fertilization takes place and a small fern starts to grow.


That first stage is like moss also a sporophyte reproduces in a similar fashion. It also attaches similar to moss to the substrate with rhizomes. This is tiny microscopic hair roots that actually grow directly from the leave. These rhizomes are so small it wedges itself into nooks and crannies from the substrate it grows to. The leaves also attach to each other.

Submerged, this fertilization process doesn't seem to occur and then the prothallium reproduces vegetatively.

If you search for Microsorum pteropus (Java fern) prothallium you might find some shops also selling this. Or if you are growing Java fern it might occur in your aquarium that it grows a batch of prothalliums that never develop into a fern. The narrow-leaved Microsorum sp. seems to like to grow this.

You can trim it with simply cutting it and Bonsai it into the desired shape. I did model it into a ball. :)

That's also the tricky part, snipping off plant material and syphon it out of the tank at the same time. If you come to close with the hose you might suck pieces or the entire thing from the driftwood. That's what happened to me. Than reattaching it in place is difficult.

You have to be extremely gentle with it. And it actually grows relatively fast.

Yes the plant you link to is Lomearopsis or indeed Süßwassertang. And yes it can be glued. :)
 
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zozo

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Huh sorry i made a typo in the post above.. Not Rhizomes, that should be Rhizoides. :) (Hair roots) I'm to late for editing..
 

Wookii

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It doesn't have a rhizome, it's a fern prothallium. If you look at the fern life cycle it's actually the first stage after the spore, that have a male and a female part. In Terrestrial form, raindrops splash the sperm from the male onto the female then fertilization takes place and a small fern starts to grow.


That first stage is like moss also a sporophyte reproduces in a similar fashion. It also attaches similar to moss to the substrate with rhizomes. This is tiny microscopic hair roots that actually grow directly from the leave. These rhizomes are so small it wedges itself into nooks and crannies from the substrate it grows to. The leaves also attach to each other.

Submerged, this fertilization process doesn't seem to occur and then the prothallium reproduces vegetatively.

If you search for Microsorum pteropus (Java fern) prothallium you might find some shops also selling this. Or if you are growing Java fern it might occur in your aquarium that it grows a batch of prothalliums that never develop into a fern. The narrow-leaved Microsorum sp. seems to like to grow this.

You can trim it with simply cutting it and Bonsai it into the desired shape. I did model it into a ball. :)

That's also the tricky part, snipping off plant material and syphon it out of the tank at the same time. If you come to close with the hose you might suck pieces or the entire thing from the driftwood. That's what happened to me. Than reattaching it in place is difficult.

You have to be extremely gentle with it. And it actually grows relatively fast.

Yes the plant you link to is Lomearopsis or indeed Süßwassertang. And yes it can be glued. :)
Thanks, thats great - looks like that might be my best option then if I can get hold of some.

Is that the same stuff then, as Aquasabi also have it listed here: https://www.aquasabi.com/Lomariopsis-cf-lineata-Portion - unfortunately both are 'Out of Stock' though.
 

mort

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Sorry to hijack the thread but can I ask what the difference is between suswassertang and monosolenium tenerum? I have the latter but don't know if it's definitely that species.

I also sold a lot of this a few years ago and most of the people selling it on the bay got it from me but use either species name, so you might not get what you are looking for.
 

zozo

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what the difference is between suswassertang and monosolenium tenerum?
Monosolenium tenerum is a liverwort (moss).

suswassertang is a fern Prothallium.

Growing submerged the resemblance is striking. Likely because they are closely related.
Tho if grown emerged their form changes significantly and the difference becomes more obvious.

For Lomearopsis yet nobody ever managed to grow a fern from it. The ID is based on DNA tests. Till it isn't 100% confirmed the cf. (short for the Latin: confer/conferatur, both meaning "compare") in the name will stay. I'm growing it now for over a year in a small terrarium. It lives almost at a standstill and its form doesn't really change.

But a liverwort transitions it's form and grows much more curly and compact actually a tad hard to the touch when grown emerged. Submerged it grows kinda fluffy and loose with an obvious fork-shaped adult leaf.
 
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