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Tank Help

Chrisjb330

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Joined
18 May 2020
Messages
38
Location
Nottinghamshire
Hi Everyone, i have been keeping tropical fish for 10+ years now and have recently taken the plunge into a high tech tank.

Im looking for some feedback and suggestions (please tell me if something is wrong).

My initial problem was that my Kribensis would rip out any plants i would put in so i put covers over them (tomato punnets / test tubs) which worked well at protecting them. However algae would slowly cover the inside so after 3 weeks i took them off and found they were still being pulled out. I have given the Kribs away but found that the SAE's are doing something similar. My problem is that nothing seems to be growing very much, i did get everything in vitro so theres no roots? Other than waiting im not sure where to go now.

Do i turn the lights / Co2 / Ferts up / down? Will the SAE's ever leave things alone?

Heres some details;

Fluval Rio 240
Fluval Plant 3 59W
Seachem Flourite Substrate
Bottled Co2 with in line JBL diffuser
- On a timer from 7am until 6 pm
- CO2 indicator showing green with a tint of yellow most of the time even when CO2 is off.
Air pump to come on after lights are out for an hour
Fluval 306 Filter - Main filter
JBL Cristalprofi E1501 - Lots of ceramic in here
Eheim Streamon 4000
Green Angel Rock
Bogwood
Root Tablets
Aquascaper complete plant food - Dosing at 15ml (3ml per 50l) Just a guess for now as not many plants
Approx 50% water change weekly
Filters cleaned every 2 weeks
Temperature around 26'C

Fish
8 x Clown loaches, mostly large
2 x Siamese Algae Eaters
6 x Cardinal Tetras
2 x Synodontis Petricola
4 x Blue Gourami
2 x ? Gourami

Plants
Elocharis Acicularis - Didnt last long as kept being pulled up by SAE and Kribs
Java Moss (glued) - Didnt last long as i think the SAE's ate it
Elocharis SP Mini - Was being pulled out so put a clear tomato punnet ontop and weighed down
Spikey Moss (glued) - Still there but i think its still being eaten as most stems look bare. (Heard that SAE's dont like this)
Althernanthera Rosanervig - Again was being pulled up so drilled some holes in pots and weighed down
Anubis Nana (Glued) - Looks ok for now.
Lilaeopsis Novae-Zelandiae - Sometimes coming out / being pulled out of substrate.
Curly Grass? - Had this for years and always grows
Straight Grass? - Again, always grows
Not sure what the other is?

Water parameters - Tested with API test kit
PH - 6.3 - 6.5 Hard to tell exactly
GH - 14
KH - 4/5
Nitrate - 30ppm / 50ppm (Test doesnt change from red so relying on test strips)
Phosphate - (Just ordered one)

IMG_20200518_170028.jpg

Screenshot_20200518_170829_com.inledco.fluvalsmart.jpg
 

Zeus.

Fertz Calc Meister
Joined
1 Oct 2016
Messages
4,001
Location
Yorkshire,UK
Hi Chris and welcome to the forum :D

Will the SAE's ever leave things alone?

Great when they are small, but as they get bigger they do become more challenging to keep in planted tanks, mine got a taste for my shrimp :rolleyes: so relocated them

Photoperiod

Too long..... 5-6hrs max is all the plants need, having them dip mid photo period is a no-no also, having extended time on low light settings is for our viewing benefit only, but algae also use this low level light to grow also, so try keep it to a minium esp till issues are resolved


CO2 indicator showing green with a tint of yellow most of the time even when CO2 is off.

Which suggests to me fluctuating [CO2] during the photo period, with possibly not enough flow which compounds fluctuating [CO2].

FLOW is KING in the CO2 injected tank and your does need improving IMO a spray bar along the back of the tank would work much better than what you have.

and with the DC not changing colour when CO2 off suggests not enough surface agitation, spray bar would help here too


Have you done a pH profile ? Take pH of water pre CO2 on every 30 mins till CO2 off with the time lights come on noted.

We are after a stable pH from lights on till CO2 off, if its not then we need to address/resolve also.


Aquascaper complete plant food

which folk use and get great results from, however the contents of which are 'unknown' ATM so I would stick to the recommend dose, long term with 240l tank may be worth looking into doing some DIY fert mix ;)
 

Chrisjb330

Member
Thread starter
Joined
18 May 2020
Messages
38
Location
Nottinghamshire
Thanks for the reply Zeus. Glad im doing a few things correctly.

I will rehome the SAE's when the LPS can take them.

Which suggests to me fluctuating [CO2] during the photo period, with possibly not enough flow which compounds fluctuating [CO2].

FLOW is KING in the CO2 injected tank and your does need improving IMO a spray bar along the back of the tank would work much better than what you have.

and with the DC not changing colour when CO2 off suggests not enough surface agitation, spray bar would help here too


So to elaborate on the CO2

The colour is constant as i can detect whilst the lights are on. When i check the colour in the morning it just doesnt seem to have changed much. This is why i put the air pump on however this made no difference.

The flow;

Currently using the Eheim 4000 in the left hand corner with the outlet of the second pump which has the CO2 diffuser in. The main pump outlet is the right hand side of the tank which is used to disturb the water and push the CO2 back down.

The distribution of bubbles look good to me but i have no problem trying other stuff. Ive read that surface disturbance releases the CO2 back into atmosphere so only a small amount is needed?

I made a spray bar for this tank and only took it off when i went to CO2. My issue is that it can either be over the water which creates lots of bubbles or under the water (because of the support beam, unless i shorten it and attach to the glass) and have to look at it.

If you still suggest putting it back on where do you think is best and how much movement am i after?

Have you done a pH profile ? Take pH of water pre CO2 on every 30 mins till CO2 off with the time lights come on noted.

We are after a stable pH from lights on till CO2 off, if its not then we need to address/resolve also.

From your advice i have reduced the light to 6 hours and will adjust the CO2 to come on 1 hour before and go off 1 hour before the lights go out. Im also dosing in the afternoon whilst the lights are on if that makes a difference?

I havnt done a PH Profile but will look at doing one.

The only PH measurement i have is the API test kit which is inaccurate. I also have a cheap £10 PH meter which calibration adjustment. So i can use the Ph meter and calibrate it with a known solution each time, i know my tap water is 7.4. Even then im not sure how accurate it would be to detect minor changes. Can anyone recommend one?

I have access to pharmaceutical grade RO water (PH around 5.6) and a water testing lab but its a favour to ask them to test stuff for me, PH is an easy one though. I cant use the RO water as my tap water only has a KH of 4/5 so cant really dilute it and dont see much benefit in adding the KH and GH back in, also the PH would be off unless i adjust that too.

IMG_20200519_170129.jpg
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Zeus.

Fertz Calc Meister
Joined
1 Oct 2016
Messages
4,001
Location
Yorkshire,UK
My issue is that it can either be over the water which creates lots of bubbles or under the water (because of the support beam, unless i shorten it and attach to the glass) and have to look at it.

Needs to be just under the water for it to work and move the water - yes you will see it. The only reason you dont see them on profesional scapers photos is they take them out for the pic- once your plants fill in you will not notice it

Currently using the Eheim 4000 in the left hand corner with the outlet of the second pump which has the CO2 diffuser in. The main pump outlet is the right hand side of the tank which is used to disturb the water and push the CO2 back down.

If flow is low they all need to work together to move the water- pipe outlets are poor at moving the water -spraybars or lily pipes work well

Ive read that surface disturbance releases the CO2 back into atmosphere so only a small amount is needed?

For low tech yes , but yours is high tech, plus we need to surface agitation to get the O2 in at night

CO2 to come on 1 hour before and go off 1 hour before the lights go out

normal tanks take 2-3 hrs to get pH drop then 4-5hrs after lights on plants more or less had their fill of CO2 so CO2 can go off

I also have a cheap £10 PH meter which calibration adjustment.

Great, I dont bother calibrating mine (Just done a new pH profile recently), I use make a note of the reading as it changes or stays the same. The actual pH is irrelevant IMO as all we are after is a stable pH from lights on till CO2 off. Then go of the DC colour change for an indication of [CO2]

More plants would help too as you do have a low plant biomass, more plants means there is less light for the algae
 

Chrisjb330

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Thread starter
Joined
18 May 2020
Messages
38
Location
Nottinghamshire
Needs to be just under the water for it to work and move the water - yes you will see it. The only reason you dont see them on profesional scapers photos is they take them out for the pic- once your plants fill in you will not notice it

Does it need setting breaking the water surface or just disrupting it?

normal tanks take 2-3 hrs to get pH drop then 4-5hrs after lights on plants more or less had their fill of CO2 so CO2 can go off

Ill set the Solenoid to come on 3 hours before and stay on 4 hours after

More plants would help too as you do have a low plant biomass, more plants means there is less light for the algae

Just ordered'

Hygrophila Rosae Australis
Limnophila Heterophylla
Ludwigia Glandulosa

I have started feeding sinking pellets a little more often in the day which seems to be helping with the underwater cows (SAE's)

Regarding the profile, i will do it at the weekend and get back to you.
 

Zeus.

Fertz Calc Meister
Joined
1 Oct 2016
Messages
4,001
Location
Yorkshire,UK
Don't go from 1hr before lights on too 3hrs. You will probably kill all the tanks imates:arghh:

Small steps, pH profile first or sort flow out. Good thing about doing pH profile first is you will have a reference of what it's been like, otherwise how do you know if it's any better except for waiting for plants to tell/show you.

Same with CO2 off time, doing the profile till lights off will give a rough idea of CO2 uptake.

Cutting lights back is a no-brainer IMO, but what's a few more days

Good about the plants.

When's last time you vac your gravel? ( That doesn't mean do it either !)
 

Chrisjb330

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Thread starter
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18 May 2020
Messages
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Location
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Small steps, pH profile first or sort flow out.
So, did the PH profile yesterday over the course of the day in 1 hour intervals and found that its 6.8 before the co2 comes on and sits at 6.6 all day with no fluctuations (that i can tell by colour). Also did a water change today which changed it to 7.2 briefly. All done with a new API PH test kit. ( i found the PH pen was inconsistent as i checked with two known solutions)

Also increased the angle of the powerflow pump and refit the spray bar. Is this enough disturbance or should i go more?

IMG_20200524_123759.jpg

Im also going to adjust the lights and CO2 timings tomorrow, do you think these will be ok to switch straight to or shall i stagger it over a few days?;
CO2 on at 1pm
Lights on at 2pm
CO2 off at 7pm
Lights off at 8pm
Lights on moonlight/low until 10pm

Definitely vac, scrape everything, clean it up. The impact a clean filter has on a tank is amazing.
Will look into this, although there isnt much free gravel space for me to vac.

Also checked the Phosphate which was around 5ppm

Just ordered'

Hygrophila Rosae Australis
Limnophila Heterophylla
Ludwigia Glandulosa
Planted these which look like they are happy so far, this could be because i ordered potted with roots.
 

JoshP12

Member
Joined
8 Dec 2019
Messages
544
Location
Canada
Hi @Chrisj330,

You can pull up all that detritus using a turkey baster of some kind or even sweeping your hand around and dislodging all of your detritus from your substrate.

Check out Dennis Wong:
Here is George Farmer:
Everything that is floating/suspended/sitting in your tank, decays and turns into ammonia.

In terms of the surface agitation, I would test how my pH drops with surface agitation ... with the spray bar that high in the water, a few days of evaporation could throw it off (especially if each spray disrupts the surface).

Surface agitation (gaseous exchange):
Sure, you need surface agitation, but the theoretical framework is not going to help unless we try it.

I would fill the tank to the top and watch the fish closely that day. Your pH may actually drop quicker (and it may not give a testable difference - which is good! More time to slack on top offs). If it does and your fish are healthy, then that may fix the "6.4 drop". Then watch each day thereafter (without topping off) and find the threshold.

Josh
 

Chrisjb330

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Thread starter
Joined
18 May 2020
Messages
38
Location
Nottinghamshire
As suggested i added more surface agitation, but found i had to increase the CO2 quite a bit to maintain the green/yellow colour.

Waited a few weeks and still not much difference, the plants also looked yellow so i put the CO2 indicator at the bottom of the tank and found there was little CO2 there so adjusted the powerflow angle, CO2 and the output position of the pump. Its been like this for a few weeks and things look a lot better and are actually growing.

Also increased lighting time to 7 hours and fertiliser to 20ml a day. CO2 now comes on 1.5 hours before lights.

The SAE's are now gone btw.

A lot of the old leaves have this stuff on though and has for weeks.
 

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Chrisjb330

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Location
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Stuff still isnt much better, could do with a little guidance. Also have a few questions if anyone can answer please.

FYI ordered an FX6 which will be fitted at the weekend with a spray bar along the back.

Main problem is that plants are growing but slowly and the old leaves are getting algae on / going brown.
Also have a lot of BBA mainly on the bogwood so looked at my Phosphate and Nitrates;
Phosphate is 10 ish
Nitrate is around 100 - deep red
Doing a 50% wc each week still, cleaning filters every 2 weeks.

Am i right in thinking the fertilizer adds both of these so im probably putting too much in? Dosing at 25ml with the Aquascaper fertz, but since upping from 20ml the anubis' new leaves look better, but this could be a coincidence. I have turned my blue light down from 20% to 10% on the plant 3.0 to see if that helps.

The spikey moss is doing well though! Old java moss that was glued onto the bogwood and eaten by the SAE's is growing back too.



I got a decent PH meter, (essentials PH) so can test the ph accurately now. It ends up at 6.4 / 6.5 before co2 off. But there seems to be a LOT going in the tank.

I have a question about CO2;

Do i go by the drop checker or by the PH? According to my KH my Ph should be around 6.8 for 30ppm but this is a small change in PH

Which brings me to - I know you should have a degree drop but if i put that figure into my KH my CO2 level is really high?
Where do you take your PH starting point? I know its just before co2 is on but what if there is already co2 in the tank? Do you take it from the tap water or do you leave co2 off for a few days to find this figure?
 

Zeus.

Fertz Calc Meister
Joined
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Messages
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Location
Yorkshire,UK
CO2 on at 1pm
Lights on at 2pm
CO2 off at 7pm
Lights off at 8pm
Lights on moonlight/low until 10pm

I would use 2hrs per CO2 on time

As suggested i added more surface agitation, but found i had to increase the CO2 quite a bit to maintain the green/yellow colour.

:thumbup:
Also increased lighting time to 7 hours and fertiliser to 20ml a day. CO2 now comes on 1.5 hours before lights.

I would off left it at 6hrs for photo period, 1.5hrs pre CO2 on good would still advise 2hrs
A lot of the old leaves have this stuff on though and has for weeks.

Old leaves are prone to tihis - remove them or lift plant cut off poor bit replant, Having leaves with algae on just gives lots of algae spores

Main problem is that plants are growing but slowly and the old leaves are getting algae on / going brown.

Slow growth - Excellent:clap::clap:, remove old leaves as above

Also have a lot of BBA mainly on the bogwood

Can be a problem until plants fill in which should reduce as plant biomass increases, can the bog wood be removed for cleaning ? if so soak in cheap diluted bleach, scrub, rinse lots leave 24hrs out of tank rinse replace or soak with primed water 15mins.
The spikey moss is doing well though! Old java moss that was glued onto the bogwood and eaten by the SAE's is growing back too.

:thumbup:

Do i go by the drop checker or by the PH?

Drop Checker colour only IMO to gauge [CO2] too many variables to use pH to judge/calculate [CO2] IMO

know you should have a degree drop

NO - A drop of 1.0pH is the normal goal for high tech tank, but it doesnt need to be 1.0pH mine is more others use less, its a' rough guide'


Where do you take your PH starting point?

Take a clean glass rinse it with tap water, rinse it in tank, half fill glass with tank water, wait 24hrs tank pH, use that value - well that's what I do ;)

Don't rush you have positive signs of new growth so all sounding very positive, it takes months to see the full results so don't go changing too many things to try and speed things up, as you many upset the balance, make things worse, loose track of what you have change.

1595164367292.png
 

Chrisjb330

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18 May 2020
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Location
Nottinghamshire
Thanks for the feedback, i will adjust as suggested.

The FX6 is now piped in and using a spraybar along the whole tank. (soon to be remade in 25mm pipe instead of 20mm). Getting the parts to put the Co2 inline atomiser in as below, might go to a reactor also at a later date; (taken from another thread)

1595191678145.png




Drop Checker colour only IMO to gauge [CO2] too many variables to use pH to judge/calculate [CO2] IMO

NO - A drop of 1.0pH is the normal goal for high tech tank, but it doesnt need to be 1.0pH mine is more others use less, its a' rough guide'

So am i correct in thinking the best way to set the Co2 is to use the DC around the tank (corners / high / low etc) and get a green / yellow everywhere? Then maintain that ph through the photoperiod?

Phosphate is 10 ish
Nitrate is around 100 - deep red

What about this? Was going to half my fertz and then go onto EI after this bottle is gone and maybe adjust the NPK as my tap water has phosphate and nitrate in.
Can be a problem until plants fill in which should reduce as plant biomass increases, can the bog wood be removed for cleaning ? if so soak in cheap diluted bleach, scrub, rinse lots leave 24hrs out of tank rinse replace or soak with primed water 15mins.

Taken the Bogwood out and scrubbed with a wire brush to get the majority off without having to take all the moss and Anubis off too.
 

Zeus.

Fertz Calc Meister
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Location
Yorkshire,UK
So am i correct in thinking the best way to set the Co2 is to use the DC around the tank (corners / high / low etc) and get a green / yellow everywhere? Then maintain that ph through the photoperiod?
Yes, with aid of pH testing


What about this? Was going to half my fertz and then go onto EI after this bottle is gone and maybe adjust the NPK as my tap water has phosphate and nitrate in.

Too high for both. NO3 I aim for is 30 and PO4 about 6.

If you can get your hands on water report you can account for nutrients in your tap water


Taken the Bogwood out and scrubbed with a wire brush to get the majority off without having to take all the moss and Anubis off too.
:thumbup:
 

Chrisjb330

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Hi Zeus

Another update. (lots of questions incoming!:nailbiting:)

FX6 is in with a spraybar along the back which hits the glass when the water is 1/3 empty so there is plenty of movement. CO2 in-line atomiser is also piped in as above. Currently dosing a lot less to keep the nitrates and phosphates down, at the end of the week they are P 2, N 40 ish.

Both powerheads have been removed for now.

I am having difficulty getting the CO2 right, in the sense of the PH drop and a Green drop checker. I currently have the DC on the front of the glass, does this make any difference with my setup as the water is actually pushed down?

Problem 1

Im also struggling to get the PH drop before lights on. CO2 is coming on 2.5 hours before lights at the moment and is getting to around 6.6, target being 6.4. Do i Increase this time or increase the bps? If i increase the bps they the ph will drop even more at the end of the light cycle surely defeating the object?

My other problem is that the spray bar is at the top of the tank to get the surface movement. But because of the evaporation the water level gets slightly low which causes the spray bar to break the water surface sometimes which will throw x amount of CO2 out. I could try lowering the spray bar but would lose some surface agitation.

I also have an issue with the light getting water on, im having to wipe it every day. I cant really lift it up because im using the built in hood - (Fluval Rio 240)

Current BPS - Seems a lot?



Problem 2

Black beard algae. I have removed the majority manually but theres still traces that keep coming back. Im trimming leaves but my poor Anubis dont have many left :oops:. Its also started growing on the gravel which is hard to see.

Green algae is also still here on leaves

Diatoms too

Ive also started to put a towel over the glass before the lights come on as there is a lot of indirect sunlight where the tank is placed.
This has resolved the plants turning towards the glass too!

From what i have read about BBA it is caused more by the CO2 fluctuation rather than anything else.
I have got some Hydrogen Peroxide mainly for cleaning the diffuser when i swap them over but can dose this directly onto the BBA
Also got some Seachem Excel which i can dose direct too

A lot of people are dosing either the peroxide or overdosing the excel to the tank to remove the BBA, thoughts? Or do i wait longer.

Question:

My EI dosing has come, but as i have phosphate and nitrate in ample supply, shall i reduce the amount i put in the mixture or dose less of the mixture?

Problem 3

Temperature currently set at 25'C with the new Fluval E Heater, due to the hot summer weather etc i cant keep the tank cool without changing water. What would a safe value be? I will also have this problem during winter as we use a coalburner so the room where the tank is can get hot. Currently dont have an answer without a chiller or a heat exchanger piped through the mains supply.

Plants below, old growth seems to be a problem mainly, some new growth of the Hygrophila Rosae Australis is pink, others just green no white lines etc?


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IMG_20200811_152634.jpg
IMG_20200811_152358.jpg
IMG_20200811_152433.jpg
 

JoshP12

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8 Dec 2019
Messages
544
Location
Canada
Hi Chris!

I had weighed in before on your thread and hoped it would be ok to share some thoughts again!

FX6 is in with a spraybar along the back which hits the glass when the water is 1/3 empty so there is plenty of movement. CO2 in-line atomiser is also piped in as above. Currently dosing a lot less to keep the nitrates and phosphates down, at the end of the week they are P 2, N 40 ish.

Your nutrient uptake is directly related to the availability of other nutrients. In other words, if you have hundreds of ppm of everything except 0 (pick your favorite nutrient), then the plant cannot grow and as a result, the nutrients will not be absorbed. This is known as Liebig's Law of the Minimum.

I particularly like this image:
1597244303430.png


So, the attempt to keep your "other nutrients" low will miss the fact that we need to find what is limiting it. CO2 injected into a spray bar is great! Now, we focus on "the drop" -- i.e. using pH as a proxy for an approximate CO2 concentration in your water column. The spray bar and CO2 in the bar virtually "rules out" flow (from the top of your tank) -- this does not rule out stuff that blocks water ... like hardscape or plants.

Both powerheads have been removed for now.

Great, keep them close and add them if you find you need more flow from the back of your tank to the front -- with your current set-up, I reckon you won't.

I am having difficulty getting the CO2 right, in the sense of the PH drop and a Green drop checker. I currently have the DC on the front of the glass, does this make any difference with my setup as the water is actually pushed down?

Go ahead and set up several drop checkers (if you have them) all around your tank and you can notice the difference. I would leave where you have yours and then pick up a couple more (if it is in the budget) just to check.

Problem 1

Im also struggling to get the PH drop before lights on. CO2 is coming on 2.5 hours before lights at the moment and is getting to around 6.6, target being 6.4. Do i Increase this time or increase the bps? If i increase the bps they the ph will drop even more at the end of the light cycle surely defeating the object?

My other problem is that the spray bar is at the top of the tank to get the surface movement. But because of the evaporation the water level gets slightly low which causes the spray bar to break the water surface sometimes which will throw x amount of CO2 out. I could try lowering the spray bar but would lose some surface agitation.

I also have an issue with the light getting water on, im having to wipe it every day. I cant really lift it up because im using the built in hood - (Fluval Rio 240)

Current BPS - Seems a lot?

The question as to whether or not to increase time or BPS is dependent on whether or not you actually hit 6.4 with your current injection rate. What you have observed with the increase in BPS and the chase for stability is invaluable. And the answer is in your following paragraph where you bring up surface agitation. Unfortunately, you need to find a water level and keep it there (I use an < auto top off Tunze >). If you dial in the CO2 at the "highest water level", it is quite possible that, without top ups, at the end of the week, you won't have enough. If you dial it in at its lowest point, without tops offs, you may have too much at the start. Further, the use of a skimmer and surface scum will affect CO2 concentration and necessarily oxygen concentration in the tank.

high surface agitation = high injection rate = fast response = stable = micro adjustments to needle valve will NOT kill everything

Your set up here:
1597250879189.png


Looks just a titch low. I would opt for a bit higher. Here is mine:
1597251023597.png


I would watch the tank and use CO2 BPS like it is free. The absorption depends on many things, so two tanks could have extremely varying BPS but the same CO2 concentration.

Problem 2

Black beard algae. I have removed the majority manually but theres still traces that keep coming back. Im trimming leaves but my poor Anubis dont have many left :oops:. Its also started growing on the gravel which is hard to see.

Green algae is also still here on leaves

Diatoms too

Ive also started to put a towel over the glass before the lights come on as there is a lot of indirect sunlight where the tank is placed.
This has resolved the plants turning towards the glass too!

From what i have read about BBA it is caused more by the CO2 fluctuation rather than anything else.

You are going to battle the BBA and other algaes for a while (since they are established). The goal is to get their growth monitored. The towel is good and crucial during this time. Those traces that are coming back are likely old established spores that you didn't see before and are now surfacing. Scrub them - you have to evict the algae from your tank until your tank can slow its growth down. For the anubias, it needs some leaves to grow, unfortunately, so rub them during water change, and scrape off the BBA. We want the new growth to be healthy so it does not get algae. Likely, those leaves that grew, are indicative of the system from a month ago - and a month ago, it may have grown unhealthy. So watch the new buds and see how long they stay algae free. Those old leaves are bringing in energy to grow so don't chop 'em all.

The gravel thing is a pain. Remove the piece it has spread onto, if you can.

I have got some Hydrogen Peroxide mainly for cleaning the diffuser when i swap them over but can dose this directly onto the BBA
Also got some Seachem Excel which i can dose direct too

A lot of people are dosing either the peroxide or overdosing the excel to the tank to remove the BBA, thoughts? Or do i wait longer.

Excel contains polycycloglutaracetal which is an isomer of < glutaraldehyde >. At certain concentrations, it acts as an algaecide (that is why spot dosing is nearly insta-kill). I've dosed the entire tank before and found that it really didn't do much - but I am likely the minority here. The benefit that tank-dosing will have is that it will provide a carbon source for your plants, so if you have low concentrations of CO2/flow in your tank, the plant will get it's carbon from glut.

Hydrogen peroxide will kill algae - but be careful. If you leave the anubias in it too long (or pick your favorite plant), you will melt the plant. So much so, that if you destroy the plant tissue, it may actually end up dying in the long run anyways.

Question:

My EI dosing has come, but as i have phosphate and nitrate in ample supply, shall i reduce the amount i put in the mixture or dose less of the mixture?

Problem 3

Temperature currently set at 25'C with the new Fluval E Heater, due to the hot summer weather etc i cant keep the tank cool without changing water. What would a safe value be? I will also have this problem during winter as we use a coalburner so the room where the tank is can get hot. Currently dont have an answer without a chiller or a heat exchanger piped through the mains supply.

Plants below, old growth seems to be a problem mainly, some new growth of the Hygrophila Rosae Australis is pink, others just green no white lines etc?


I do not have experience with external temperature control issues; however, I would suggest to keep your tank at the lower bound of your livestock - I keep mine at 22.

The temperature fluctuations will give rise to different diffusion rates of CO2 in the tank - this will provide inconsistency in the tank.

Why do you have phosphate and nitrate in ample supply? If you are going to try a new dosing strategy, I personally like to reset the tank with several back to back water changes, getting my TDS down as close as I can (without stress on the fish) to source water.

I hope that helps.

Josh
 

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Chrisjb330

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Hi Josh,

Thanks for your response, its much appreciated! I apologize for the lengthy posts but i like to provide lots of info.

Nutrients

My main problems are that my tap water has both Phosphate and Nitrates in and that my tank is overstocked so even more (she wont let me get rid of 'her' 8 clown loaches, come mahoosive)

My EI dosing kit has just come so i can dose the micro and macro seperately.
Im going to try half dose of the macro to start with.

If you are going to try a new dosing strategy, I personally like to reset the tank with several back to back water changes, getting my TDS down as close as I can (without stress on the fish) to source water.

I have never measured my TDS, is this something i should look at? I can do a 50% wc saturday and sunday to reset, thanks.

Co2

I think to sort this i need to set a water level

Currently its to the recommended level as on the tank sticker, BUT i get a water on my LED light. I can move the light up slightly but not much due to the tank lid. So the next option is to lower the water level.

The spray bar in the picture is my old one, the new one i have made is the full length of the tank in 25mm PVC.
The way i set it up is to turn it towards the water surface UNTIL it starts to break and create bubbles (Bad right?) then go back slightly. This could be due to the amount of flow i have due to the FX6.
The spray bar usually ends up pointing slightly down from horizontal
I am also limited going up any more by the tank brace, i could get around this by using 4 elbows but this would surely mess up the spray bar flow distribution.


dependent on whether or not you actually hit 6.4

To elaborate, im actually getting to 6.4 already by the end of the period, just not at the start. This makes me think to keep increasing the pre time.

I already have a surface skimmer :cool:

The auto top off is expensive! I dont usually top the tank off much outside of the hot weather so im hoping it shouldnt be too much of a problem.

Algae

I have started dosing the CO2 supplement at the recommended dose to combat algae and help the plants out. I will use a combination of this and the peroxide to soak/spray underwater at the BBA.
The overdosing will be a last resort for me as it has risk imo.

Temperature

This i dont know what to do.

I have it set at 25'c but if the ambient temperature goes above this it climbs with little i can do. We currently have 30'c+ weather here, so the temperature is going up to 28'C before i can change more water etc.

Lighting

Plant 3.0 currently set to 5% blue 80% Red and 100% whites (as of this week, had it 20% lower for a few weeks with the reduced ferts)



So my plan is to:

Maintain this lighting level, dose with the EI ferts with 50% macro and see how i go
Most likely lower the water level to prevent the light being fouled by water minerals
Adjust the spray bar to suit
Dose the Excel
Keep attacking the BBA with excel and peroxide
Weekly 50% water changes
 

JoshP12

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Canada
All of that sounds great!

I do like TDS metres - I’d get one; and they are cheap.

Good on the evaporation - I cant have a lid, and I like automation hah.

Yes on the co2, just add 30 minute more to ramp and watch the plants.

I haven’t kept many big and heavy waste fish, but I’d imagine that with sufficient weekly water changes, you could dose a modified macro to get that potassium and phosphate and be ok.

For the spray bar, have it ripple like nature. Just run it horizontal and see how it looks. Your strategy to run it until it breaks, then bring it down seems good.

Hang in there and keep us update.

Josh
 

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