The Nymph's Spring (EA900)

[shangman]

@alto suggested something smart (and kinda obvious can't believe I didn't think of it before) to me in a message, that I should set this tank up first as a grow-up tank for the baby apistos, so they have a bigger space to grow into, which I think is a great idea. I just need my first filter - I think an Oase biomaster thermo 600, so can work with lowtch or hightech later. Will set the tank up with seeded media, new+ old sand, a really big load of dried leaves, a bit of misc wood I have, maybe a few basic epiphytes and a lot of floating plants as a low tech while they grow so they can get to a good size for the shop. The babies are rapidly getting bigger now and a bit squeezed in the 60L, and motherfish would clearly prefer they left, I think it would help a lot with water quality in both tanks.

I'm going to use this as a chance to test out doing the water changes, as I think I could start with filling the tank and get used to the new regime, and see whether I can manage a 50% weekly, or 25% double weekly, small amounts daily, etc. Or I'll learn that 50% weekly will kill me, and go no CO2. @alto mentioned that the fish might benefit from a bit of extra tap water as well, so it will be mixed as we've been chatting about here, and we'll see how that goes. I think if I go no CO2 I can still achieve something really beautiful, I just wanted to try it out and get to have some beautiful colourful textured stem plants, but it would also be a great challenge to try and make something just as beautiful without CO2.

Will order my filter tonight I think!

Ps. if anyone wants a group of unsexed (ish, I might be able to make some guesses) Apistogramma Macmasteri Redmask juveniles I think there are some big enough to go as most are 2cm, with maybe 4-6 being 3cm. If interested, they'd have to be picked up from South London I don't think I can ship. Of course people can wait longer too and get them bigger lol, but they're already very cute and funny and it is a joy to see them grow, so I get it if people are interested in that. I think I will try to set up this tank this weekend, so I could sort some of the bigger ones out then if anyone was interested. No worries if not, I can always give them to the shop and do enjoy watching them grow Will post this in my other thread too in case and merge that thread with this one.

Below are some photos, you can see that the babies are really getting bigger. Apologies that they're quite blurry, they are so fast! I also included a photo of a baby lotus plant I found yesterday which doing some trimming, perfect timing for it to grow a new plant, that's definitely going in the new tank. Not sure if you can tell, I bought some hygrophila from @Konrad Michalski for another tank, but he gave me such a big portion i added some to this tank too, and it looks great with the grasses. Definitely going to be using more of it soon, it's such a lovely plant that really reminds me of oak saplings.

In these photos they mostly look like males, but a week ago they mostly looked like females with black eye slits and dark front fin bits, so I guess we'll see! The temp has been 26 the whole time, so should be an even mix of sexes, fingers crossed.

 

[shangman]

I don't run co2 on the tanks anymore because I saw no improvement by doing so. I do keep things simple and have riparian growth out of the top. In truth I don't think I need to do water changes on the tanks but it makes me feel happier and does no harm.

I'm very curious about the riparium plants, what sort do well for you? I love tanks with some growth out the top!

 

[mort]

I'm very curious about the riparium plants, what sort do well for you? I love tanks with some growth out the top!

Depends how big you want to go really. Peace lillies are great but can get several feet high, I had a monstera deliciosa which grew six leaves over two foot across (before I had to take it out as the tanks only 120 liters, a friend has it now and I've started with a cutting), syngonium are great, so are various ficus, fittonia, calathea, basically quite a lot of plants you see in a diy shop selection. If you want really inspiration check out hyrophyte threads hydrophyte

Or this amazing thread by hitmanx The Celestial Swamp - A voyage through a flooded forest fringe (Shallow Riparium) he has a few other great journals as well.

 

[ScareCrow]

I have Syngonium podophyllum 'White Butterfly' it grows a new leaf every couple of days and that's not an exaggeration. While it's nice to see, it does mean I've had to up my fert dosing to full EI in a low tech tank and still don't see much change in TDS at the end of the week. Epipremnum or pothos are a commonly used plant. I have but find its trailing habit a bit frustrating, probably my fault for not rooting it into anything though. Tradescantia are another common and easy plant to use for a riparium section.

 

[Courtneybst]

Would definitely take some off you as I'm only 15 minutes away but I use 100% tap water

Also not sure how they fare with Amano shrimps? Not sure if you've ever mixed them?

They're so cute!

 

[shangman]

Depends how big you want to go really. Peace lillies are great but can get several feet high, I had a monstera deliciosa which grew six leaves over two foot across (before I had to take it out as the tanks only 120 liters, a friend has it now and I've started with a cutting), syngonium are great, so are various ficus, fittonia, calathea, basically quite a lot of plants you see in a diy shop selection. If you want really inspiration check out hyrophyte threads hydrophyte

Or this amazing thread by hitmanx The Celestial Swamp - A voyage through a flooded forest fringe (Shallow Riparium) he has a few other great journals as well.

Oh wow thank you for the list, it's great that these common houseplants work! Can't wait to check out those threads tonight and see what could work here. My dad has quite a few weird rare philodendrons and monsteras, including some he doesn't care for any more so maybe I can steal one and try that. Is your light suspended quite high for them? Would love to see a photo of your monstrous monstera, it sounds glorious.

I have Syngonium podophyllum 'White Butterfly' it grows a new leaf every couple of days and that's not an exaggeration. While it's nice to see, it does mean I've had to up my fert dosing to full EI in a low tech tank and still don't see much change in TDS at the end of the week. Epipremnum or pothos are a commonly used plant. I have but find its trailing habit a bit frustrating, probably my fault for not rooting it into anything though. Tradescantia are another common and easy plant to use for a riparium section.

Sounds like your syngonium loves you! I'm partly interested in the ripariums for that filtering capability, it sounds like they do a fantastic job keeping your water clean if you have to add all that extra. Does yours trail out and dangle over the sides? Maybe I need to install some trellis on the wall behind the tank...

Do you root your plants in some aqua soil, or just wedge them in a bit of wood to get started? I'm hoiing to get some wood that sticks out of the water a bit that I can base things on/around.

Would definitely take some off you as I'm only 15 minutes away but I use 100% tap water

Also not sure how they fare with Amano shrimps? Not sure if you've ever mixed them?

They're so cute!

I'm going to try 50% tap and 50% rain in this new tank with the babies to see how they do, apaprently some hardness isn't bad for growing baby fish. If they do fine in that, then maybe in 2 weekends you could pick some up, and if you think they don't seem happy in your water then I'll gladly take them back. 😂 If you have a big water carton or something I can give you some of my rainwater too (like 20L or something) to ease them in, in case that helps.

How big are your amanos? I have my wild type cherry shrimp in the same tank as them - they do seem to eat the tiny ones (if they can catch them which I've only seen twice), the once they get to about 1.5cm the shrimp are fine and now I have a small hidden colony in the back. They seem to have a good idea of what will and won't fit in their mouths!

 

[ScareCrow]

Sounds like your syngonium loves you! I'm partly interested in the ripariums for that filtering capability, it sounds like they do a fantastic job keeping your water clean if you have to add all that extra. Does yours trail out and dangle over the sides? Maybe I need to install some trellis on the wall behind the tank...

Do you root your plants in some aqua soil, or just wedge them in a bit of wood to get started? I'm hoiing to get some wood that sticks out of the water a bit that I can base things on/around.

The roots are sat in the back of the tank and the plant sort precariously hangs over the edge. There's a pic of the riparium section in my journal.
For the Syngonium I made a planter out of a plastic pot, a clip off an old skimmer bracket and filled it with eheim substrat pro media. I had the media lying around and it looked like expanded clay balls used in hydroponics. I imagine any open media will work, the pothos rooted into the filter sponge. As long as it allows water movement past the roots I think it will be fine. I'm also planning on attaching plants to some emergent wood. I found some pieces that I think will work well, just need to come up with a way of holding them upright and stable.

 

[mort]

Unfortunately the monster monstera now lives with a friend. It looked a little silly in a 60x45x45cm but he has an 11ft lit with a skylight. I growing a cutting from it so will pop some pics up when it gets going. I'm trying to control myself now and will probably shamelessly copy Iain with his ficus pumila

Taiwan Bee not so nano

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk Quality mate fairplay. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

www.ukaps.org

If your dad is a philodendron fan then he could probably be an eBay millionaire judging by how much they are going for at the moment. I saw a cutting of something that didn't have an id go for over 7k a few weeks ago.

Syngonium white butterfly is a nice plant, this is possibly the most impressive riparium growth you'll find on here (syngonium steals the show colour wise) taken from sciencefictions cool clown loach pond.

Forgot the pic of the pond itself View attachment 120856

 

[aec34]

@shangman if you need any floating plants, I am always overrun with salvinia + frogbit - happy to send you some

 

[ScareCrow]

If your dad is a philodendron fan then he could probably be an eBay millionaire judging by how much they are going for at the moment. I saw a cutting of something that didn't have an id go for over 7k a few weeks ago.

They really do, I recently bought a philodendron 'Prince of Orange'. It's one of the hipster varieties so normally costs a decent amount (no where near 7k though). I've been looking for about a year and managed to get one that had been really neglected so it was the same price as common philodendrons. I want to try and grow it as a riparium plant as philodendrons seem to do really well but couldn't justify spending silly money just in case it didn't work out. If it does well I may consider buying some of the more pricey varieties to add to the riparium and then take early retirement

 

[Another Phil]

Another Phil said:


To avoid sucking up fish I have a piece of fishing net rubber-banded to my siphon hose. Rockpool type fishing net as sold in The Range for £1-£2. aquarium nets are too fine and get blocked by mulm. Sainsbury sell reusable fine mesh bags in fruit&veg for 30p if you are just siphoning water.

Yes this is deinfitely what I'll do, makes total sense. Do youvac your substrate before you siphon most of the water?

I've got a low point under the filter outtake made of roofing slate with some flat river rocks glued to it to keep substrate out where mulm naturally accumulates. I also have a pointed stick (the type that supports orchids) taped to my siphon hose and jutting out about 30mm that allows me to stir areas between twigs, around plants, etc. I use small 10/8mm hose as it is slow and i can easily put my finger over the bucket end if my Corydoras pygmaeus get too close. Only changing 40L so works for me.

Drinking fountain/water cooler bottles might be more convenient for water storage.

Devil's Ivy Epipremnum aureum is what i use as a riparian plant. the aerial roots grow rootlets in the tank and is self clinging to walls. works if you have a window it can grow towards otherwise you will have a continuous fight to keep it away from your tank light.
see also Taiwan Bee not so nano

 

[Courtneybst]

I'm going to try 50% tap and 50% rain in this new tank with the babies to see how they do, apaprently some hardness isn't bad for growing baby fish. If they do fine in that, then maybe in 2 weekends you could pick some up, and if you think they don't seem happy in your water then I'll gladly take them back. If you have a big water carton or something I can give you some of my rainwater too (like 20L or something) to ease them in, in case that helps.

How big are your amanos? I have my wild type cherry shrimp in the same tank as them - they do seem to eat the tiny ones (if they can catch them which I've only seen twice), the once they get to about 1.5cm the shrimp are fine and now I have a small hidden colony in the back. They seem to have a good idea of what will and won't fit in their mouths!

That sounds good to me! Let me know how they get on. I don't think the rainwater will be necessary as it wouldn't make a dent in my tank but appreciate the offer.

I just got a big batch of amanos today. The smallest ones are probably the size of an adult cherry shrimp and my biggest one is about 2 inches (no exaggeration lol).

 

[shangman]

The roots are sat in the back of the tank and the plant sort precariously hangs over the edge. There's a pic of the riparium section in my journal.
For the Syngonium I made a planter out of a plastic pot, a clip off an old skimmer bracket and filled it with eheim substrat pro media. I had the media lying around and it looked like expanded clay balls used in hydroponics. I imagine any open media will work, the pothos rooted into the filter sponge. As long as it allows water movement past the roots I think it will be fine. I'm also planning on attaching plants to some emergent wood. I found some pieces that I think will work well, just need to come up with a way of holding them upright and stable.

I rather like the way your plants go with the wallpaper, it looks like that's growing out of the tank too! Awesome to know about the media, when I started I accidentally bought a load extra, don't realising the filter came with it already. Looking forward to see what you do with your emergent wood plants.

Unfortunately the monster monstera now lives with a friend. It looked a little silly in a 60x45x45cm but he has an 11ft lit with a skylight. I growing a cutting from it so will pop some pics up when it gets going. I'm trying to control myself now and will probably shamelessly copy Iain with his ficus pumila

Taiwan Bee not so nano

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk Quality mate fairplay. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

www.ukaps.org

If your dad is a philodendron fan then he could probably be an eBay millionaire judging by how much they are going for at the moment. I saw a cutting of something that didn't have an id go for over 7k a few weeks ago.

Syngonium white butterfly is a nice plant, this is possibly the most impressive riparium growth you'll find on here (syngonium steals the show colour wise) taken from sciencefictions cool clown loach pond.

I'm sure that plant loves it's new home, I'd love a big skylight for jungle-housing purposes. Was looking at <Patrick Blanc's house> a week ago and dreaming... perhaps this tank will be my own mini version with emergents up the back wall (why am I kidding I'm definitely going to do this). That ficus pumila is absolutely amaaaazzzzingggg, thanks for the link, I think I copy it too... aren't we all here to shamelessly pilfer ideas from eachother? 😆 I love that loach pond too, that along with Tom's Poco Pozo have me dreaming of an indoor pond tank one day.

It has annoyed my dad that previously relatively attainable plants have become crazt expensive now that us millenials have realised how great they are. I don't think he has any £££ ones, he usually goes for weird ones with hairy stems that get too big, but unlike you they won't be rehomed, I just put up with getting hit in the face by large leaves everytime I go down the stairs.

They really do, I recently bought a philodendron 'Prince of Orange'. It's one of the hipster varieties so normally costs a decent amount (no where near 7k though). I've been looking for about a year and managed to get one that had been really neglected so it was the same price as common philodendrons. I want to try and grow it as a riparium plant as philodendrons seem to do really well but couldn't justify spending silly money just in case it didn't work out. If it does well I may consider buying some of the more pricey varieties to add to the riparium and then take early retirement

Ooh that's very nice, I think that's worth the price! Good idea to try it and see, if it does well it's going to look glorious!

 

[shangman]

@shangman if you need any floating plants, I am always overrun with salvinia + frogbit - happy to send you some

Yes please! I had some good floaters for a while, but they recently got overrun by both spyrogira AND aphids so I had to chuck the lot. One problem's enough, 2 is too many!!

I've got a low point under the filter outtake made of roofing slate with some flat river rocks glued to it to keep substrate out where mulm naturally accumulates. I also have a pointed stick (the type that supports orchids) taped to my siphon hose and jutting out about 30mm that allows me to stir areas between twigs, around plants, etc. I use small 10/8mm hose as it is slow and i can easily put my finger over the bucket end if my Corydoras pygmaeus get too close. Only changing 40L so works for me.

Drinking fountain/water cooler bottles might be more convenient for water storage.

Devil's Ivy Epipremnum aureum is what i use as a riparian plant. the aerial roots grow rootlets in the tank and is self clinging to walls. works if you have a window it can grow towards otherwise you will have a continuous fight to keep it away from your tank light.
see also Taiwan Bee not so nano

I use exactly the same kind of stick all the time in my tank, it's probably my most used tool 😄 So you just have a little space that collects all the mulm so you can suck it up all at once? Sounds like a great strategy

Water cooler bottles is a great idea, thank you, they might be a bit less annoying that the carton I use at the moment too, and easy to get.

Yes I'm not sure about the light, there isn't a window close to this tank so the plants would probably not like me very much. However I think the light (twinstar) is very strong, so maybe I can hang it a bit higher for them.

That sounds good to me! Let me know how they get on. I don't think the rainwater will be necessary as it wouldn't make a dent in my tank but appreciate the offer.

I just got a big batch of amanos today. The smallest ones are probably the size of an adult cherry shrimp and my biggest one is about 2 inches (no exaggeration lol).

Will do! I'm sure they'd love your nice new big tank I think that cherry shrimp adult size is ok, the babies are only just that size themselves, and amanos are much fiestier than cherries. I love those massive amanos, my two are currently also about cherry-sized, can't wait for them to become behemoths among the cherries.

 

[aec34]

behemoths

This is not a word which is used often enough 😀
Send me a message when you’re ready for some floaters - I’ll stop putting them in the compost!

 

[mort]

It has annoyed my dad that previously relatively attainable plants have become crazt expensive now that us millenials have realised how great they are. I don't think he has any £££ ones, he usually goes for weird ones with hairy stems that get too big, but unlike you they won't be rehomed, I just put up with getting hit in the face by large leaves everytime I go down the stairs.

Local garden centres seem to have quite a few of the species that are going for silly money, reasonably cheap. I personally hate the way everything that looks like a bird has poo'd on it is suddenly worth a fortune (not a fan of marbled variegation). I bought a monstera dubia a few years ago for a tenner and tiny unrooted cuttings are going for a ton, I don't know if this is just the world we are having to deal with at the moment or a new normal. I know some aquatic plants are vastly over priced due to popularity but I hope it doesn't effect the hobby to much.

I only really rehomed it as we both want to see how big it can get and I have cuttings from it anyway. I normally get hit in the head by my plants as I have far to many but this monster got so heavy it snapped it's support. It went from 1 palm sized leave to those 2ft across with large fenestrations in about 18 months, whilst the mother plant (one my mum has had for over 40 years) is still relatively small. Just goes to show what a little bit of fish poo can do.

 

[mort]

I remembered I had a picture from a long time ago. This was on its temporary tank before I took the cuttings. The leaves are considerably bigger now

Monstera adansonii emersed?

Has anyone tried this?! I want to try and grow it down the side of my lily pipes to hide them?! What ways do you guys grow “trailers” down the side of your tanks?! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

www.ukaps.org

 

[shangman]

This is not a word which is used often enough 😀
Send me a message when you’re ready for some floaters - I’ll stop putting them in the compost!

😂 Will do, thanks! Hopefully next week if the filter comes.

Local garden centres seem to have quite a few of the species that are going for silly money, reasonably cheap. I personally hate the way everything that looks like a bird has poo'd on it is suddenly worth a fortune (not a fan of marbled variegation). I bought a monstera dubia a few years ago for a tenner and tiny unrooted cuttings are going for a ton, I don't know if this is just the world we are having to deal with at the moment or a new normal. I know some aquatic plants are vastly over priced due to popularity but I hope it doesn't effect the hobby to much.

I only really rehomed it as we both want to see how big it can get and I have cuttings from it anyway. I normally get hit in the head by my plants as I have far to many but this monster got so heavy it snapped it's support. It went from 1 palm sized leave to those 2ft across with large fenestrations in about 18 months, whilst the mother plant (one my mum has had for over 40 years) is still relatively small. Just goes to show what a little bit of fish poo can do.

Sometimes you find something great in Ikea too. I also am not a fan of the basic variagation, why have white when green is obviously the better colour! I feel the same way about those sad tiny anubias. RE: rare plants, I've been researching and I can only find a few rare aquatics which I find really interesting. One of them is the Echinodorus iguazu 09 which is very large with fat round leaves and dark veins, which I think is super nice, and goes for about £75 - £125 for a plantlet, and seem to be mostly tank grown which is good. Wary of rare plants that are being snatched from the wild, but there are only a few specimens left.

I remembered I had a picture from a long time ago. This was on its temporary tank before I took the cuttings. The leaves are considerably bigger now

Monstera adansonii emersed?

Has anyone tried this?! I want to try and grow it down the side of my lily pipes to hide them?! What ways do you guys grow “trailers” down the side of your tanks?! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

www.ukaps.org

Wonderful!! That's a great plant, I wonder how you get something like that to grow in a way that means you can keep giant plants like that without it breaking out/snapping off/destroying the tank. 🤔

 

[shangman]

If you want really inspiration check out hyrophyte threads hydrophyte

Or this amazing thread by hitmanx The Celestial Swamp - A voyage through a flooded forest fringe (Shallow Riparium) he has a few other great journals as well.

Well I spent all night yesterday looking through these threads and I'm definitely gonna have to do a riparium-style tank!! I had planned to change my 60L into a blackwater tank once the new big tank is set up, and I think having the riparium section on top of that would look GREAT, and would do some filtering for me, since there won't be any plants under water (except for maybe a lily if I can find a nice small one). I really loved looking through all the journals, I've seen riparium tanks before but never really understood how they're put together, so it was great to see all the hidden pots with suckers and floating rafts and tricks. I found a reasonably priced 60 x 40 x 40 tank, where I could use all my current equipment with to do it up, and the extra depth would be great for more planting up top. I really love all the blackwater botanicals and that tropical look. I've been collecting dried leaves, and even getting my dad to collect the dead leaves from palms and things like that in his work garden, and planning to get a nice selection from Crowder's Aquatics. I think my kuhli loaches would really love it and would come out more, and then I might move the pygmy cories and sparking gouramis I have into it too, so the 45L becomes a nice breeding tank.

I'm also really intrigued by mixing one or two tropical houseplants with plants which we usually use underwater like pogostemon eretus (fabulous flowers) and hydrocotyle small creepers. Could be very nice!!

...Wait a second, I seem to be planning another journal in this current journal... must get back to thinking about my big one. Will post some nice inspriations tonight 😂

 

[mort]

Wonderful!! That's a great plant, I wonder how you get something like that to grow in a way that means you can keep giant plants like that without it breaking out/snapping off/destroying the tank. 🤔

Hanging it with twine definitely doesn't work, well not in my case. I'm still working out how to do it on my potential new scape but I think a moss pole, wrapped around a solid rod, for it to cling to is the safest way. I might however try it planted behind the tank in a conventional pot and train a couple of the roots into the water.
Even though with only six 2ft leaves, it was quite a small plant, it had grown over 30 long aerial roots which were 20 ft + long in some cases. I had just coiled them round like a hose but you can see why they are able to cling to trees in nature.