Very poorly sparkling gourami

[AlecF]

I have an escalating problem with my sparkling gourami. two weeks ago I noticed one with a ragged tail. I think it had been an issue for a while. By the time I really took note the tail was almost completely rotted away. I put him in a HT. I then noticed another, with a less ragged tail but swollen eyes, and then one with swollen lips. Now I have another with swollen lips and some tail rot. In one image you can see the lips. The second is a bad photo, but the fin issues are vaguely visible – this was just in a bowl for 2 seconds while I transferred them to the HT. Almost all the adults are now affected. The young sparklers are fine, so far. The flanks of the most recent poorly ones look patchy. The second one has some mobility issues, spending time at at angle. I have them in a HT at a temperature of 78-79. I'm adding aquarium salt and Interpret Anti-fungus. I've given them a 10 second bath in methylene blue. They are from a community tank with Peacocks, Cory, pencil fish, a pleco, and ember tetras. Nothing else shows any issues. The water tests are all fine, including ammonia. I have been testing for over a week, every day.I had thought that Sparklers couldn't get DG disease? The fin rot is rapid and not due to nipping. There's no sign of fungus that I can see. I can't take better photos as the HT is a large poorly lit plastic tub – all I have – which is hard to make clear images in. While the symptoms vary slightly they clearly have the same disease. It worries me how fast it has spread. It's also surprising that all the young seem fine, so far. I have had 2 in the HT for 5 days. Possibly the one with balance issues is slightly better. The one with no tail is doing OK, no sign of recovery and it may never, as the rot was so severe. Has anyone ever heard of Sparklers getting DG disease? I'm not sure what else I can do except use these meds. I do a 50% water change every day. The TDS is c 150. I have an almond leaf in there. I'm unsure what to do about the young ones in the community tank. Do I remove them, even though they are well? Putting them with the sick ones just seems to confirm they would also get sick. I'd estimate the problem could be 2 months old or more, as I was away from the tank and I think the fin rot on the first one was much slower. I'd have expected other fish to be affected by now if it was a standard all-fish virus, so it does seem likely this is confined to gourami? Any advice?

 

[MirandaB]

Looks bacterial to me,especially with those lips but odd that it's only the gourami showing signs of it.
How are they normally in the tank,are they bullied at all by the other fish?

 

[castle]

Possibly some aggression in the tank creating injuries that are getting infected?

 

[AlecF]

I don't see any aggression and I don't think this is the cause. They are feisty and if there was fin nipping the embers would be first in line. Also I'd have seen aggression. I don't think the eyes and lips would swell up so fast – I mean the pattern is a rapidly spreading infection. I would guess the embers would be infected by now if this affected all fish. That's why my main focus is to rule out gourami disease. @mort I recall you had some knowledge of Sparklers?

 

[Witcher]

@AlecF not sure if it's any help at all but it looks like the only ones having this problem in your tank are the fish with labyrinth organ - is it something about the air or maybe water surface?

 

[AlecF]

Helpful suggestion. I don't think so. I doubt that would cause fin rot, or not so rapidly. I have a spray bar and sponge filter, so there's lots of surface agitation. I also don't see any scum. And the dories aren't going to the surface in an unusual way. I think that the impact on eyes, lips and find suggests a virus of some kind.

 

[PARAGUAY]

If you can get hold of esha 2000 l think it would be worth a try but follow instructions to the letter. A quarantine tank would have been the preferred option. Some fish are affected quicker by water quality issues

 

[AlecF]

Thanks. If you mean a quarantine tank upon purchase I have had these for 18 months with no issues. The tests were all clear for water quality. I will have a look for. I guess the thing I most want to know is whether DG disease could be involved. I can't find a clear answer on the inter web.

 

[mort]

I must admit my first thoughts why these were the only ones affected was the same as Witcher but unless you live in a really cold house, I don't think it is the problem.

I'm not really sure what's going on but bacterial issue sounds most likely and perhaps these are just more susceptible at the moment.

 

[AlecF]

Thanks @mort. Aye, I'm sure it isn't oxygen. I actually had 2 sponge filters as well as the spray bar, until I moved one sponge into he HT, so there was a lot of bubbles and ripples. If there are oxygen issues the corys tend to stay still and huff, but they have been happy. The swelling on the lips and fin rot is very bad, but there's no visible fungus, no cotton wool no threads. I'm surprised the one that lost his entire tail is still alive. None of them have died, but they all look very poorly. Are there any gourami exerts anyone knows of?

 

[mort]

Hi Alec, it's not the oxygen in the water that we are worried about with labyrinth fish, it is the temperature of the air they come up to breath that can be the problem. This isn't an issue if you have a lid, as the air stays warm, but if the air is cold it can damage their labyrinth organ. I don't think it is the problem here though.

I still think Miranda is correct from the infomation you have posted. The lips and ragged fins mention support this as a best guess so far for me.

 

[AlecF]

Thanks. I don't think the air is that cold. It seems bacterial to me. I have ordered Esha 2000 and hope it will do more than the Interpret anti-fungus, which hasn't much much difference. I was away for a period and there may have been some over-feeding, so that could be a cause. It still seems odd that the Sparklers are affected to badly and all the other fish are fine.

 

[John q]

I guess the thing I most want to know is whether DG disease could be involved.

Hiya Alec, I don't think there is a lot of information regards sparkling Gourami getting DGI because its incredibly uncommon, obviously rare situations can occur.

I've lost a few dwarf gourami to DGI and once seen the symptoms are fairly easy to spot (bloated abdomen, thinning back end, scales almost look metallic and dull, rounded head, and loss of appetite). Looking at the pictures of your fish I'd be tempted to say this isn't iridovirus.

Spoiler: Not a nice picture

Sorry I can't be more helpful as to what the actual cause of your fish health is.

 

[AlecF]

Thanks @John q. That is helpful. You are right, it doesn't sound like that disease fits. I'm too much of a newbie and haven't had enough sick fish to recognise every disease. The mix of fin rot and bloated lips is new to me. I haven't found anything that really describes it yet online. I will keep them separate in the HT, try the Esha 2000, and hope. It's strange that it hasn't spread to any other species in the tank. I've done more water changes, just in case there is a water issue that my tests aren't picking up, but usually all the fish respond if there is an issue. Hopefully it's useful when we share our knowledge on here even when we don't know the answers. Sorry you've lost a few DG, but I am glad it didn't take them all out. They are lovely fish. I wish there was a website for fish diseases that was as comprehensive as this one is for plants.

 

[AlecF]

Just an update. Added first dose of Esha 2000. One gourami is on its side on the bottom and looks very poorly. The one with puffed lips also has dark marks on the edges of its ragged fins. The other 3 are so-so and able to swim. I have lowered the height of the water so they can take breaths more easily, and added a smaller sponge filter, upping the bubble rate. Not much else to do but wait.

 

[Myrtle]

Good luck, sorry I can't offer any advice.