Wallichii substitute!

[KirstyF]

Hi All
I’m after some fine leaved stems for my hardish water. 12kh/gh.

I love Wallichii but don’t think they would fair well in my water so wondering if anyone has some recommendations for a substitute with a similar fine leaf type and a little bit of colour would be nice.

Running Co2, medium light, full EI for anyone not familiar with my tank.

Thanks in advance for any replies. 😊

 

[Hanuman]

You have 12KH. That's violent!
Maybe Myriophyllum tuberculatum? Although I am not certain it can stand 12dKH as I have never had water that high in KH.

 

[JacksonL]

myriophyllum roraima will grow in anything in my experience. Larger stems but same bushy fine leaves, also has a nice rich coloured stem.

 

[ybvs.a]

What about Rotala Vietnam? (Not H'ra). Looks very similar imo and is allegedly lower demanding than Wallichii.

edit: I read your post a bit fast. Your water might be a bit too hard, although I still think it would be a safer bet than Wallichii.

 

[KirstyF]

Thanks for the responses guys. 👍

You have 12KH. That's violent!
Maybe Myriophyllum tuberculatum? Although I am not certain it can stand 12dKH as I have never had water that high in KH.

Yeah, RO is not an option (tank is just too big) so gotta work with what I have!!
Lovely looking plant and just the form that I’m after. I’ve heard it can be a bit tricky but could be worth a try as it appears to be available at least. Would be interesting to see if I can get it growing well.

myriophyllum roraima will grow in anything in my experience. Larger stems but same bushy fine leaves, also has a nice rich coloured stem.

This one is also pretty and, on reading up about it, seems to be a fairly robust, which would be a bonus. Unfortunately I’m struggling to find it for sale anywhere. 🙁

I’ve recently added some Mayaca red in a couple of places. Not sure how that’s going to do, but I think either of the above plants could compliment it fairly well. I’m wanting something that will grow to 18” ideally.

 

[John q]

Have you looked at Limnophila hippuridoides @KirstyF

 

[KirstyF]

Have you looked at Limnophila hippuridoides @KirstyF

I have now 😊
Thanks for the suggestion.

I think the leaves may be a little heavier than I would ideally like but has potential for some nice colour so food for thought. 👍

 

[ceg4048]

I love Wallichii but don’t think they would fair well in my water

Wow, where is that written?
R. Wallichii in water GH >26 and KH>20

Cheers,

 

[Hanuman]

@ceg4048 So this Walichii = high KH = no bueno, yet another myth?

 

[KirstyF]

Wow, where is that written?
R. Wallichii in water GH >26 and KH>20

Cheers,

Wow 🤩

Just a whole bunch of websites and stuff that say they should be grown in soft water.

What do they know, right! 😉😂

Can I take a wild guess and say that, if this is one of your tanks @ceg4048 , it has good Co2, good distribution, plenty of ferts and nothing over complicated going on? (other than the years of knowing what you are doing, of course!)

I’m high tech, EI, with fluval plant 3 - 59w over a 22” depth, currently running at 50% for 7.5hrs per day. Tweaking photoperiod to 8hrs at the moment and just started tweaking intensity (very slowly)…..no particular light target, just evaluating plant response as I go.

I really would like to grow this plant. Any tips? 😊

 

[ceg4048]

Wow 🤩

Just a whole bunch of websites and stuff that say they should be grown in soft water.

What do they know, right! 😉😂

Can I take a wild guess and say that, if this is one of your tanks @ceg4048 , it has good Co2, good distribution, plenty of ferts and nothing over complicated going on? (other than the years of knowing what you are doing, of course!)

I’m high tech, EI, with fluval plant 3 - 59w over a 22” depth, currently running at 50% for 7.5hrs per day. Tweaking photoperiod to 8hrs at the moment and just started tweaking intensity (very slowly)…..no particular light target, just evaluating plant response as I go.

I really would like to grow this plant. Any tips? 😊

Hi KirstyF,
It's exactly as you say. Yes this was one of my tanks and nothing special was needed other than the realization that CO2/flow/distribution are the most important factors in any tank. The more light that you use the more critical these factors become. I would avoid being overzealous with lighting and allow the plants to mature slowly. After they gain weight and get stronger then they can absorb a lot of abuse.

Cheers,

Cheers,

 

[ceg4048]

@ceg4048 So this Walichii = high KH = no bueno, yet another myth?

Mate, to be honest, I wasn't even aware of this myth until I read the OP. I wonder if folks are confusing wallichii with macandra?
R. macandra is one of the handful of plants that are reported to struggle in high KH.
Of course, people are so lazy and cavalier when it comes to CO2/flow/distribution that many faults which occur are immediately blamed on seemingly rational, yet grossly obtuse reasons. This plant takes a while to get started, yes, but otherwise has been a typical weed for me. I'm astonished at these reports quite frankly.

Cheers,

 

[KirstyF]

Hi KirstyF,
It's exactly as you say. Yes this was one of my tanks and nothing special was needed other than the realization that CO2/flow/distribution are the most important factors in any tank. The more light that you use the more critical these factors become. I would avoid being overzealous with lighting and allow the plants to mature slowly. After they gain weight and get stronger then they can absorb a lot of abuse.

Cheers,

Cheers,

Thanks for the response.

Well I’ve taken a punt and ordered some so 🤞

Tinkering with light mostly just to see what happens (it feels like that is part of the learning journey too) but going very very slowly, so no photon blasting in the near future. 😉😊

 

[ceg4048]

Thanks for the response.

Well I’ve taken a punt and ordered some so 🤞

Tinkering with light mostly just to see what happens (it feels like that is part of the learning journey too) but going very very slowly, so no photon blasting in the near future. 😉😊

Good plan. You can even float the plant at the surface for a few days to allow a better transition. Many don't realize that in the natural habitats, plants are not just dunked under water. The rains come and the plant has the ability to adjust to the submerged state as the water level rises. We tend to ignore all that and immediately put the plants in a compromising situation because we are in such a hurry. Floating the plants at the surface allows them to have access to CO2 as well as to Oxygen while they change there body chemistry to living under water.

Cheers,

 

[Hanuman]

I wasn't even aware of this myth until I read the OP

We learn everyday. 🤓

I wonder if folks are confusing wallichii with macandra?

I don't think so. Wallichii has been said right and left, up and down to be KH and EI sensitive. I've never grown it so I have no idea but that's what you read wherever you put your eyes on starting by the experiment created by some unwelcome folk in the forum: Aquarium

@GreggZ We got another myth debunked.

 

[KirstyF]

Good plan. You can even float the plant at the surface for a few days to allow a better transition. Many don't realize that in the natural habitats, plants are not just dunked under water. The rains come and the plant has the ability to adjust to the submerged state as the water level rises. We tend to ignore all that and immediately put the plants in a compromising situation because we are in such a hurry. Floating the plants at the surface allows them to have access to CO2 as well as to Oxygen while they change there body chemistry to living under water.

Cheers,

Thanks for the tip, I’ll give that a go. 👍

 

[Witcher]

GH >26 and KH>20

Is it an amount directly from the tap or after injection of CO2?

 

[erwin123]

Note the careful choice of words "Prefer soft water" which doesn't mean impossible to grow in hard water, you just need to work harder and according to the presentation - use leaner dosing.

 

[Hanuman]

Note the careful choice of words "Prefer soft water" which doesn't mean impossible to grow in hard water

Yes and shortcuts are quick to be made.

The use of RO and TAP as a preference unit is also very confusing and could be misinterpreted. Maybe Vin defined in another slide what TAP and RO water are exactly so I don't know but TAP water can be wildly different from city to city, area to area, country to country. RO water can also be remineralised. In my opinion is would have been wiser to provide hardness ranges so we all know what we are talking about.

 

[erwin123]

Yes and shortcuts are quick to be made.

The use of RO and TAP as a preference unit is also very confusing and could be misinterpreted. Maybe Vin defined in another slide what TAP and RO water are exactly so I don't know but TAP water can be wildly different from city to city, area to area, country to country. RO water can also be remineralised. In my opinion is would have been wiser to provide hardness ranges so we all know what we are talking about.

Yup, the info is inside his presentation and also in his rotala kill tank thread - didn't want to cut and paste too much here as it's already being discussed in the Lean Dosing thread.