defective leafes on Microsorum pteropus

[H..]

Thanks Iain for your comment, but the flow around the plant is really good due the outflow fron an FX6, and it is really flowing good around the plants leafs. (the outflow is actualy pointing towards the plant, opposite of what the Picture on top of the thread is showing, due to maintainance)

The aquarium is luminated with 2*54w T5 and the pteropus it is quite exposed to the light, so if the plant need more carbon like you say, I can do nothing to it but mooving it to an more shaded place. Because it is an low tech tank with no extra CO2.

I am slowly changing microsorum plants from pteropus to windelöv, because windelöv plants are looking good and not affected.
Maybe i am leaving an small plant of pteropus left to see if it is coming back to its beauty.

There are nearly 200 fish in the tank, and feeding is aproximetly 0,5 dl tetra pro dry food and week.
Can I get any suggestions in further maintainence of this tank.

H.

 

[NatureBoy]

Iain's comments make perfect sense, you cannot simply name it low tech and therefore it is.

2 54w T5 is quite a high energy light source for a low light plant like microsorum, even more if you put in in full light. This equates to a need for CO2 or a drop in lighting.

Do you use tap water with carbonates? Plants like vallis will be thriving in those conditions because they can utilise carbonates to photosynthesise, so they can match the light to the carbon source. Microsorum cannot, that's why some of your plants are ok some not so

 

[H..]

I just have to throw in some pics from another tank of mine, also 500 liter and the same plants, and aproximetly the same treatment as the one i am having problems with.

There are some BBA also in this tank, but only on the wood nowdays

H.

 

[H..]

Whatever there is carbonates in the water or not i do not know, but i do waterchanges regulaly every 15-20 Days, and PMDD every time.

This my other tank, which is going on straight with its good balance and great growth is why i am sceptical to the carbon thing.

There is not much difference in the lighting between these two tanks, and yet they come out so different.

Dont know anything but skipping the pteropus now.

H.

 

[H..]

Hi again!

It has been almost one year ago and i did not skipp the microsorums totaly, but changed positions. Now my microsorum is still not doing well in the first tank. Even my M.windelöv has become in very bad shape.

The deffection of carbon that was suggested earlier in the thread was not quite what i belived in, and now i am starting to see an pattern. I have a few more "long time service" aquariums with both vallisneria and microsorum in, and my obsevations are definitive. When there is thriving vallisneria(V.gigantea in this case) present, the microsorum will have deficiencies.

deficiencies like blackish leafs, with holes in, just like the ones in the first photos. And leafs that do not come out to be like they are ment to be, for example micro.windelöv, one leaf with no "fingers". And M.peteropus with reallu bad leaf shape.





So! Today i have in the recent 500 liter tank, cleared all of the vallisneria gigantea and i am going to establish even more of my cryptocoryne crispatula balansae instead.

What i wonder is, if anyone of you scapers hav had any success or even un succesfullnes with the combination of vallisneria gigantea (or other vallisneria) and microsorum.

I belive there are some sort of alleopathy or something like alleopathy involved.

I do not make weekly big water Changes, but every other week, and i ad pmdd every time. very regularly every 14-18 Days.

If there is an alleopathy deficienci from vallisneria it should come out clearly now when i have cleaned it out. But please help me if you have the same feeling as i do.

H.

 

[sciencefiction]

It looks to me like a systematic nitrate deficiency but I could be wrong. Vallis is a fast growing plant, so it could outcompete others, especially slow growers like java fern.

 

[stu_]

Not sure i can add too much, but Vallis + Java Fern both grew quite happily together in this old tank.
No additional carbon added.Just fed the fish a lot.

 

[Mick.Dk]

There's the same "old saying", that Vallis and Crypt's can't grow together........
No offence - but your observations are really NOT conclusive. The only thing, you can conclude is that you can't grow them together, the way you operate your tanks. Be it waterquality, fertilisers, light, CO2 addition (etc, etc, etc)........
- the hypothesis of out-competing by quickly absorbing accessable nutrients is one - waterquality suiting one, not the other is another - issues with flow/distribution a third - and the list is long.
To conclude, you would need to rule out the possibilities one by one, by only changing one parameter at a time - a method really not suited for hobby !!
I grow Vallisneria with Microsorum - and Vallisneria with Cryptocorynes - successfull all the time. So I seriously doubt there's alleopathy involved !!