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New computer.....iMac?

Ady34 said:
Hi Tony, thanks for the info.
If I go for the iMac it'll be situated away from any direct sunlight so don't think that the reflection will be an issue.
Do the apple store sell refurbed iMacs too as this would be an even cheaper alternative I imagine.....although the pcworld 12 months interest free option is tantalising 🙂,Ady
Click to expand...

Hi Ady

Yes, their refurb store has a 21.5" Imac in there right now. Its not the very latest, most slender model but is still a great spec. Only £100 cheaer than a new one though, and the warranty is shorter. I've had several of their refurbs and never had an issue :

Refurbished iMac 21.5-inch 2.7GHz Quad-Core Intel Core i5 - Apple Store (UK)

Good luck with which ever you choose and PM me if you need any help with it 🙂

Tony
 
AndrewH said:
Damn, I missed out on this conversation. Coming in a bit too late now I feel!
But here are my two cents...

I am a freelance programmer and Apple developer, as well as writing software for PC and online.
I currently own the fastest Macbook Pro you can get, and the fastest (at least in processor) desktop PC which I spec'ed and built myself.

I've owned Macs and PCs in one form or another for years now.
Here's my thoughts:

FOR PC:
- a well spec'ed PC will usually out-perform a Mac in terms of speed. (Im talking about a custom built PC with hardware components that compliment each other)
- PCs are obviously much cheaper (eg. my Macbook Pro cost about £2000 - my top of the line PC cost £800 and blows the Macbook out of the water)
- with a PC, you have much more scope for customisation. (eg. would you like to run 2 or three screens? This is normal for PC but you are going to need some additional cables and software for Macs)
- [echoing Paulo's point] almost all software is available for PC so you can pretty much be sure of getting what you need
- games. If thats a consideration then PC is the way to go. Maybe your kids want to play some online games, this is going to be a limited choice for Macs.
- cross compatibility. Things like printers, networks, connections to other computers are all fairly straight forward for PCs and again, getting stuff like printer drivers that works is pain free. Macs, in my experience, have been tricky to get talking to other network devices such as printers or servers.
- everyone else uses PCs! (well ok, I know that alot are on Mac) but lets face it, most people are on PC. The point being that if someone gives you a file its in PC format, if you send them something, its in Mac format, so you can potentially start to experience problems opening and using these. (this is becoming less-so with Windows 7)
- stick with Windows 7!

One point I want to add in here is that Im really surprised that alot of the praise of Macs here so far has been with the "visuals".
I believe that to be a completely mute point. Visuals are critical to me (I need to be able to design an interface with crisp HD clarity). Invest in a good monitor and thats what you get. If you use a cheap bit of crap that came with a bundled PC then yes, it probably doesnt look as sharp as Macs, but go and buy a really good hi-res IIYAMA or similar and you wont be dissappointed (and for the vast money you save buying PC over MAC, then you CAN afford that big 24" screen!)

FOR MAC:
- plug and play in its truest form. You switch it on and it does what you need. Simples!
(Id like to add one caveat here though - it does what you want providing you want to do something that Apple have provided for. If you step outside the normal every-day type of computing then I have ran into huge problems getting my Mac set up as I want. eg - I run 4 monitors on my development machine. Macs cannot do this - I spent £300 trying to make it happen only to be beaten!)
- you are much more protected against viruses/malware/etc
- ease of getting OS updates and new apps/software through the App Store
- status. Lets face it, a large part of why some people buy Macs is to say they have bought a Mac! (well done Apple marketeers)
- customer support. It is exemplary. Fact.

So, conclusion... what side do I advise for you?
Well, let me say that Im sure you wont be disappointed if you get the iMac or Mac MINI. Great machines.
But...
I would recommend a GOOD pc. Much easier on your wallet (more fish things can now be bought!!! huzzah!), excellent performance, and the ability to be used for anything you would want all contribute to keeping PC on top in my opinion.

(typed from my PC)
:happy:
Click to expand...
Hi Andrew, and thanks for the very informative reply :thumbup:
Taking on board everything you have said, and others, i can see the benefit of a pc. It seems die hard computer lovers will thrive on making their own to suit and will be happy for it. Unfortunately im a dummy and plug and play sounds good to me 🙂 also great customer support is a must for me with my lack of knowledge....apple seem to have this nailed which is always reassuring.
Im not a gamer, and the family are still young, consoles will be the way forward in that respect i think so i wont need to worry about that....for a while!
Multi screens is a valid point, although the only time i find it useful is when browsing and searching information simoultaneously, in which case ill have the ipad too. Also forgive my lack of understanding, but i think you can run several browsers at the same time on the imac so i could flick easily between pages...not quite the same but still its 😎 to me.
I know what you mean about
AndrewH said:
it does what you want providing you want to do something that Apple have provided for.
Click to expand...
although for what im using it for i dont think ill want anything that i cant get....does the mac come with some sort of document creating facility like word? id use that but thats about it.
Ive had a joke on here about styling, but when talking with the wife about it i hadnt once mentioned this as a reason to buy. For me speccing my own pc would be impossible as i dont know enough about them, troubleshooting would be a headache as i dont understand them so these are the main reasons for leaning towards the imac, i know if there was an issue it would get sorted and i can just buy and use knowing ill have a decent spec system far more capable than me....but there just incase 🙂
Im sure for you for example who works with computers, you can see the benefits of a pc which can far outweigh the iMac, but for me im sold....nearly 😉
Thanks again, its interesting also to hear of sticking to windows 7, ive suggested this to my Dad who's also looking to upgrade, and will be going the pc route.
Cheerio,
Ady.
 
Tony Swinney said:
Hi Ady

Yes, their refurb store has a 21.5" Imac in there right now. Its not the very latest, most slender model but is still a great spec. Only £100 cheaer than a new one though, and the warranty is shorter. I've had several of their refurbs and never had an issue :

Refurbished iMac 21.5-inch 2.7GHz Quad-Core Intel Core i5 - Apple Store (UK)

Good luck with which ever you choose and PM me if you need any help with it 🙂

Tony
Click to expand...

Thanks for that info and the kind offer of tech help.....i may need it 😱
Yeah £100 is a lump of money, but maybe not so in the grander scale of things.....id prefer out the box new unless it was several hundreds cheaper.

stuworrall said:
Jigsaw24 also sell old new stock cheaper too
Click to expand...
Cheers Stu :thumbup:
 
Sounds like a good plan then Ady - think you have thought it through well mate, and your reasoning behind wanting to go Mac is sound.
If you don't mind the higher expense, I believe you will thoroughly enjoy it - it should give you years of trouble free computing!
Good luck, and health to enjoy it and all that 🙂
 
very comprehensive Andrew 🙂 nicely put down, hence why I will not replace my desktop with a mac 😉 but for most users indeed the Apple will do and be much easier to manage than a Windows machine, also people that have Windows tend to mess about with it much more than people with a Mac which a little more tied down, therefore less prone for people to mess with, the more flexible manufacturers are with their OS the more problems people can cause them, so its always down to peoples own needs and budgets.

I purchased a very powerful PC that can play most games on my 1080p TV for £300 5 years ago, all I did was replace the HDD with a solid state drive and its flying still, I don't see me needing to upgrade for another 3 years at least! I can connect up to 3 monitors to it with no need for any extra software or special cables so sorted there too! Only thing I keep adding to it is external storage that I can add to any computer, I have actually purchased a Raspberry Pi now to connect my 15Tb of space to it and use it as a network file storage for all my computers and media streaming devices so I don't need to keep a computer on all the time, that cost £40 😉

But like you say yourself you not very techie and I reckon your best bet is indeed an Apple 😉

have a look at this windows 8 video!






:crazy:
 
AndrewH said:
Argh, I really wanted a SSD for this machine, but just couldnt justify the cost at the moment.... but one day! Awesome pieces of kit.
Click to expand...
Best £100 you will ever spend 😉 just purchase one for the OS drive so doesn't need to be that big, mine is 120Gb and keep the existing drive for file storage.
 
Ady34 said:
Multi screens is a valid point, although the only time i find it useful is when browsing and searching information simoultaneously, in which case ill have the ipad too.
Click to expand...

Should you ever need more screen space the Imac can run a couple of extra monitors too 😉

Ady34 said:
does the mac come with some sort of document creating facility like word? id use that but thats about it.Ady.
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Apples word processing software is called "Pages" and their spreadsheet software is "Numbers" - you can download both from the App Store (which will already be installed in the mac) for £13.99 each. Microsoft do make their Office suite for Mac, but its £110.

Tony
 
Tony Swinney said:
Should you ever need more screen space the Imac can run a couple of extra monitors too
Click to expand...
Can you show me how this is possible Tony?
I couldnt get this to work, and when I finally did (by buying the Matrox TripleHead2Go external adaptor at £300 the resolution was rubbish and couldnt support my 3 x 24" monitors that my PC did easily. (maximum possible with Mac was 3 x 19" - yuk)

The only way I know to get three monitors on a Mac is to buy Mac CINEMA displays and use thunderbolt cables to piggy back them onto each other.
But at over £500 EACH - this hardly seems like a viable option for most.
But maybe you know another, better way?

Tony Swinney said:
Apples word processing software is called "Pages" and their spreadsheet software is "Numbers" - you can download both from the App Store (which will already be installed in the mac) for £13.99 each. Microsoft do make their Office suite for Mac, but its £110.
Click to expand...

My problem with this is what happens when you want to send a file to someone else. Most likely they will be on a PC and have Office. Now you are stuck.
I know there are convertors available, but they do not support all features within office and can cause foul ups (most recently this happened to me on a "Keynote" presentation which did not function correctly on PC, even when saved "for PC compatibility" flagged.?
 
AndrewH said:
Can you show me how this is possible Tony? The only way I know to get three monitors on a Mac is to buy Mac CINEMA displays and use thunderbolt cables to piggy back them onto each other.
But at over £500 EACH - this hardly seems like a viable option for most.
But maybe you know another, better way?

My problem with this is what happens when you want to send a file to someone else. Most likely they will be on a PC and have Office. Now you are stuck.
I know there are convertors available, but they do not support all features within office and can cause foul ups (most recently this happened to me on a "Keynote" presentation which did not function correctly on PC, even when saved "for PC compatibility" flagged.?
Click to expand...

Re the monitors, you use a MiniDisplayport to Displayport cable ( or MiniDisplayPort to HDMI cable depending on your monitor ) out of the thunderbolt port on the mac, or a connected peripheral. I believe you can run up to two external monitors in addition to the iMac screen, but I only run one.

Re Pages / Numbers, yes this can indeed be a problem. Though in the context of this thread I suspect that Ady is not looking to work on documents that need to remain editable by a third party that much. You can output pdfs from Pages / Numbers to share, but obviously they're not editable. If you need that then Office for OSX is the ( expensive ) answer 🙂

Tony
 
Yeah, you can only run one additional monitor that way unless you do the piggy back technique I mentioned earlier.
If you dont want to fork out, £500 for each monitor, you can use non-Apple HDMI or DVI monitors, but then you must use something like the Matrox EGA (£300 plus cables) to achieve this, and it can only go up to a certain resolution (and looks blurry even under that res.)
 
Hi guys, again thanks for all the info, its much appreciated.
I've just been back to the shop and think I'm gonna go for it 🙂
Tony, your right, I'm not intending to be sending documents to a third party, and like you say it's a £13.99 app for pages, the chap in the shop was pretty helpful and showed me them.

Next question, apple care, worth the £140 extra for 3 years cover? Seems to be worth it to me for the tech help and extra warranty, but am I likely to need it? I'm thinking this may be a good option for me as there's so much potential that I'd never even realise was there unless I asked someone 🙂
 
LondonDragon said:
Best £100 you will ever spend 😉 just purchase one for the OS drive so doesn't need to be that big, mine is 120Gb and keep the existing drive for file storage.
Click to expand...
And if like me you like keep on continuing to "dump" stuff on your rather small solid state disk C: (on PC), 250GB in my case, just use the "MKLINK" with /J to create a directory link to your non SSD drive ie "mklink /j c:\download d:\download" then all the stuff in c:\download is mapped to d:\download, your monster non SSD disk, not taking up space on SSD disk. All software just works fine, as knows nothing about links.
 
ian_m said:
just use the "MKLINK" with /J to create a directory link to your non SSD drive ie "mklink /j c:\download d:\download" then all the stuff in c:\download is mapped to d:\download, your monster non SSD disk, not taking up space on SSD disk.
Click to expand...
You don't even need to mess about with this using the command line, there is a little program called SymMover that does this with ease for you, just add a source folder, say where you want it mapped to and it will move it to any disk you want and maintain the C: links, that way you have a visual list of all your mappings too 😉

Its also freeware: Moba Software
 
Well.......i did it! :woot:

I have to say im over the moon with my purchase, to me its already awesome and i have only set it up and used it for less than an hour. Everything is just so straight forward.....it does everything for you.

Many thanks to everyone who has offered advice and opinions in this thread, its much appreciated.

im a happy boy 😀
Cheerio,
Ady
 
Congrats Ady, did you get the iMac or the Mac mini in the end?
 
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