Crypts missing something but I don't know what Help please

Paul Willi

Member
Joined
5 Nov 2019
Messages
62
Location
Maidstone
I hoping someone could help me to identify what's missing in my tank for the plants. They seem to be lacking something. The large crypts are new to the tank few days ago. Majority of smaller crypts about month in tank. Tank is 125l juwel Rio with T5 lighting with reflectors 5.5hrs . Dosing easycarbo daily 2.5ml, dosing TNC complete 3ml daily for 6 days, have 10no tropica nutrition capsuled. weekly water change 50% with seachem prime. Plain gravel sub with the capsules
Plants seems to be lacking something any thoughts appreciated
 

Attachments

Oldguy

Member
Joined
27 Aug 2018
Messages
375
Location
Gloucestershire, UK
smaller crypts about month in tank.
Crypts take some time to get established. They tends to make roots/rhizomes first then leaves. Old leaves will then melt and be replaced with new growth. Once established their root system be be very wide spread. As you have reflectors on your lights you might find that the petioles will remain short.

(Depending on species some people remove all the leaves before planting - there are threads on the forum. Never done it myself.)

Assume grey pipe on back wall is spray bar for CO2 or is it for circulation.

Your plants look good to me. You just have to be patient.
 

Paul Willi

Member
Joined
5 Nov 2019
Messages
62
Location
Maidstone
Did have pressurised co2 but removed. So 2 external filters still running and liquid carbon. Plants just seem to deteriating rather than improving. Thanks for reply
 

Edvet

Global Moderator
Staff member
Joined
15 Aug 2013
Messages
5,149
Location
Lelystad, Netherlands
Nom harm in removing the reflectors, crypts can do with low light. Other than that they don't look that bad, they just need a dose of "patience";)
 

dw1305

Expert
Joined
7 Apr 2008
Messages
10,495
Location
nr Bath
Hi all,
Should I remove reflectors then?
Tank is 125l juwel Rio with T5 lighting with reflectors 5.5hrs
It is unlikely to be too much light, mainly because you have such a short photoperiod. Having said that I like a <"floating plant">, because it allows you to take carbon (C), and light, availability out of the equation.

Looking at the plants I'd agree with @Edvet, they look all right, they just look a bit yellow (both old and new leaves). I'd try adding some more nitrogen (N), potassium (K), magnesium (Mg) and iron (Fe). @GlenD gives a breakdown for "TNC Complete" in <"How and when..."> and it is pretty low nutrient.

Nitrogen and potassium can both be supplied by potassium nitrate (KNO3), and magnesium from magnesium sulphate (MgSO4.7H2O) "Epsom Salts". Have a look at <"How do you mineralise....> for a link to the Rotala Butterfly nutrient calculator, and the workings for using dry salts.

Because you live in Maidstone I'm going to assume you have pretty hard tap water? and that, combined with the open nature of the gravel, is likely to lead to problems with keeping iron in solution. Have a look at @Zeus.'s <"Olympus is calling"> for some comment on different chelators for iron.

cheers Darrel
 

Paul Willi

Member
Joined
5 Nov 2019
Messages
62
Location
Maidstone
Looked at the dosing calculator. Daily dose complete 15ml for ei daily, but as I only using liquid carbon I’m assuming 50% dose so 7ml daily. Does that sound ok and is it ok to double ferts instantly or should it be gradual?
Sorry if dumb questions but trying to learn
 

dw1305

Expert
Joined
7 Apr 2008
Messages
10,495
Location
nr Bath
HI all,
Does that sound ok and is it ok to double ferts instantly or should it be gradual?
Yes, you can double them straight away.

Most people on the forum use dry salts, rather than proprietary fertilisers, because it works out a lot cheaper, but it doesn't matter where an ion comes from, once it is in solution every potassium ion (K+) etc. is the <"same as every other one">.
Sorry if dumb questions but trying to learn
It isn't a dumb question at all, plant require all the essential nutrients for growth, they just need them in <"very different amounts">.

Light intensity drives photosynthesis and after that I like to think about plant growth as analogous to a car assembly line, but in this case the limiting nutrient is the slowest operation in the assembly and if you don't have any essential element the assembly line grinds to a halt or, in our case, the plant just doesn't grow.

With a few, <"very clear cut">, exceptions we don't what nutrients a plant is deficient in, and even if you have <"an analytical lab., water testing may not be able to tell you">. We can only make "best guess" suggestions, based on on likelihood, our experience and the total amount of a nutrient that a plant requires.

In this case plants need a lot of carbon, nitrogen and potassium and calcium rich, hard, (water like yours) can reduce the availability of magnesium and iron.

Both Estimative Index (EI) and <"Duckweed Index"> were developed to try and do away with need for <"accurate water tests">. A floating plant has first dibs on light and access to 400 ppm of CO2, so it takes these to factors out of the equation.

cheers Darrel
 

dw1305

Expert
Joined
7 Apr 2008
Messages
10,495
Location
nr Bath
Hi all,
So your Mean of 87.56 mg/l Ca isnt too bad
It looks like a blended water source from a mixture of aquifer and surface water, because there is a lot of variation around the mean. If you look at the conductivity values they range from 420 microS to over 800 microS.

If the water was entirely out of a chalk aquifer it would be a value much closer to @Zeus.'s or <"mine">.

cheers Darrel
 

Paul Willi

Member
Joined
5 Nov 2019
Messages
62
Location
Maidstone
That’s all well over my head I’m afraid, just gobbly gook. That’s why I reverted to premixed n non pressurised co2 as I just didn’t know what I was doing. Hopefully I will get tank nicely growing then try dry ferts when need to replace. Your a wealth of knowledge Darrel I guess you work in a lab. If I end up overdosing the complete ferts to try to ensure enough of everything present, will that lead to problems as I’m not using pressurised co2?
cheers
 

dw1305

Expert
Joined
7 Apr 2008
Messages
10,495
Location
nr Bath
Hi all,
Hopefully I will get tank nicely growing then try dry ferts when need to replace
You can buy dry fertiliser starter kits from <"Aquarium Plant Food UK"> etc. @George Farmer, TNC etc have a range of <"fertilisers">, which you could buy via <"Aquarium Gardens"> etc.
I guess you work in a lab.
<"I do">, but I only have bits and bobs of chemical knowledge, I'm really a botanist.
If I end up overdosing the complete ferts to try to ensure enough of everything present, will that lead to problems as I’m not using pressurised co2?
You can definitely end up with too many nutrients, you can either use the EI idea of a large (50%) weekly water change, or you can use <"changes in conductivity"> over time to indicate whether you need to change more water.

Even if you have a lab. at your disposal its quite difficult and time consuming to do rigorous water testing, which is why I like having a plant to do it for me.
Both Estimative Index (EI) and <"Duckweed Index"> were developed to try and do away with need for <"accurate water tests">. A floating plant has first dibs on light and access to 400 ppm of CO2, so it takes these to factors out of the equation.
cheers Darrel
 

Similar threads

Top