doing away with filters.

Discussion in 'Filters, Filtration and Pumps' started by Mark Evans, 24 Jan 2009.

  1. Mark Evans

    Mark Evans Expert

    Messages:
    6,492
    Location:
    newark notts.
    heres my question,

    i'm running 2 filters on my 120cm. 2028 and rena xp2. i want a korolia power head for a dead spot or just to speed up flow in the front of my tank.

    now this got me thinking....if i got rid of one of my filters and run just one, could i buy say,.... 2 korolias and place them strategicly and still be ok for filter bacteria in just the 2028?

    so then i'd be running 1 x 2028 and 2 korolias which could be hidden better than a filter in and out

    mark
     
  2. aaronnorth

    aaronnorth Member

    Messages:
    3,955
    Location:
    worksop, nottinghamshire
    It depends on the stocking, lightly stocking the tank will mean less ammonia being produced so the beacteria in the filter along with the plants will be able to help keep the levels down.
     
  3. Mark Evans

    Mark Evans Expert

    Messages:
    6,492
    Location:
    newark notts.
    good point, but it is do-able? surely 1 2028 would keep up with a shoal of tetras
     
  4. aaronnorth

    aaronnorth Member

    Messages:
    3,955
    Location:
    worksop, nottinghamshire
    Yes.
     
  5. Ed Seeley

    Ed Seeley Member

    Messages:
    3,262
    Location:
    Nottingham
    I have my Rio running on just the Juwel filter for filtration and that has about half the amount of sintered glass media in it that 1 basket of my 2128 has in it and the filter works great. Bacterial colonies in most of our tanks are almost certainly limited by the waste that is produced rather than space on the decor, pipes and filter media.

    BTW my other 180l tank with the 2128 has only 2 baskets filled with media (1 sintered glass and one ceramic prefilter hoops), 1 is completely empty and it deals with all the waste perfectly (and that includes a couple of pretty large wild angels, 8 cories, medium sized tetras and a couple of dwarf cichlids! I think we really do overdo the amount of media needed in filtering our tanks.

    My only other question Mark is why 2 koralias? Wouldn't it be better to run one larger one? It should be more efficient and there'd be less gear in the tank.
     
  6. Mark Evans

    Mark Evans Expert

    Messages:
    6,492
    Location:
    newark notts.
    well i dont actually know. just so i could place them in different parts of the tank. do you think one bigger one would be ok? is the korolia 4 too much with the 2028? the tank is 260 L 120cm long

    i'm not sure how these korolia things work.
     
  7. Ed Seeley

    Ed Seeley Member

    Messages:
    3,262
    Location:
    Nottingham
    They're really diffuse flow; totally unlike a normal powerhead. That means you can go way over a flow rate and the fish don't mind the flow at all. Even my Apistogrammas, which prefer slow flowing backwaters, cope with the flow fine. I've got 1 koralia 1 on my rio 180 and the flow is good but I think I could have got away with the 2 and the Juwel filter with no real issues. That tank is 1m long so not too much shorter than yours. I reckon the 3 might be enough but I know you like your high flow! The three alone will give you a turnover of 12.3 times the tank's volume whereas the four will give you 17.7 times on it's own! Add in the 2028 with a rating of 750lph for the filter's turnover and you'll have 15.2 times and 20.6 times respectively!

    Looking at the website (http://www.hydor.it/en/products/show/27) it seems that each 1 pump uses 4.5W of power for 400gph of flow, whereas the 3 uses 5.5W of power for 850gph of flow! The 4 uses 11W for it's 1,200gph.

    I think I'd stick with the 3 as it's far more efficient and will still give you 15 times turnover with the filter!
     
  8. Mark Evans

    Mark Evans Expert

    Messages:
    6,492
    Location:
    newark notts.
    brilliant Ed, thanks very much for the info. i may just go with the 3 ;)
     
  9. Garuf

    Garuf Member

    Messages:
    4,959
    Location:
    Leeds.
    Rather than get rid of a filter I'd try the spray bars vertically and see if that makes any difference, I normally find it's by far the best way of getting the whole water column moving.
     
  10. GreenNeedle

    GreenNeedle Member

    Messages:
    2,706
    Location:
    Lincoln UK
    My filter is there purely to filter now and the Koralia1 for the flow. When you think that a powerhead is internal with virtually no flow reduction (mine is 1500lph) compared to the filter with its limitations and restriction (mine is 700lph x 50% average = 350lph) then the filter is providing hardly any of the flow.

    However the filter does its job filtering still and with higher circulation it can only be good as it will keep particles in suspension longer.

    I think 5-6x filtration is fine for a planted tank. Remember fish only tank owners tend to say 2-3x!!! Therefore you should easily be coping with a decent fishload and then some extra capacity for plant waste too.

    The 10x suggestion on filtration was mainly for flow really.

    AC
     
  11. jay

    jay Member

    Messages:
    693
    Location:
    Harrow, Middlesex
    This thread is right up my alley :wideyed:

    Anyway, I've been looking into a Hydor for my 120cm too. I have just a Fluval 405 external filter and it just isn't enough.
    Reckon the 3 circulation pump. I believe this would be fine for a 4 ft planted set up.
     
  12. Mark Evans

    Mark Evans Expert

    Messages:
    6,492
    Location:
    newark notts.
    i added 2 x 2 korolias just the job.for something like a iwagumi with low growing plants 1 would be enough.

    i've added a no.1 to my MA scape along with a 405 thats in a 3 footer
     
  13. Garuf

    Garuf Member

    Messages:
    4,959
    Location:
    Leeds.
    I'm against the koralia's I think they're hideous, I'd advocate an external pump with a co2 diffuser everytime, this takes 2 pieces of equipment out and you can use lilys or spray bars mounted vertically to really get the flow going.
     
  14. jay

    jay Member

    Messages:
    693
    Location:
    Harrow, Middlesex
    They are a bit rank but all you'd really see in my tank is the lead.
    Just not sure about what single external filter would be enough to circulate in my 4ft.
    Was looking at a Superfish 4sp Pro filter but I dont think thats enough flow, and all the eheim filter codes give me a headache.
     
  15. Ed Seeley

    Ed Seeley Member

    Messages:
    3,262
    Location:
    Nottingham
    You can always take them out for photos if you feel that much against them!

    IMHO they are perfect, apart from their appearance. They provide a high volume, low velocity current of water for tiny wattages so you get a lot of movement for the watt. The fish are also not blown around all over the place as the velocity isn't too high!
     
  16. Garuf

    Garuf Member

    Messages:
    4,959
    Location:
    Leeds.
    How many litres are we talking? It might be worth looking at Sam (themulous) thread and seeing what he did to get some good circulation.
     
  17. Mark Evans

    Mark Evans Expert

    Messages:
    6,492
    Location:
    newark notts.
    korolia 2 is 2300L per hour i got 2 :wideyed: theres not one dead spot everything sways....everything.

    i tried the 405 on its own in my MA scape. no flow in the foreground. i switched the korolia 1 on and hey presto! forground movement. they are brilliant things.

    like ed says, just take them out for pics. disguise them behind well trimmed stems too ;)
     
  18. jay

    jay Member

    Messages:
    693
    Location:
    Harrow, Middlesex
    My tanks just over 200l
     
  19. Simon D

    Simon D Member

    Messages:
    460
    Location:
    Leicestershire
    I'm deffinately with Ed on this one! I've got a Koralia 1 (1,500 lph) in a 60 ltr which gives 25 x turnover on it own without the 550lph internal Eheim Aquaball.

    The "high volume, low velocity" that Ed refers to is spot on, I thought the fish would be pinned to the glass and the plants uprooted, but it's perfect. All the plants sway gently and the fish, general community types, enjoy playing in the flow. It's hard to beleive it is actually 1,500 lph.

    I did want the Koralia nano (1.000lph??) but my lfs didn't have one in stock and I didn't want to wait or have to go back three days later as it's a 30 mile round trip (I live in the middle of nowhere) So I went with my usual compulsive purchase instinct and got the 1, no regrets at all, two months down the line.
     
  20. Mark Evans

    Mark Evans Expert

    Messages:
    6,492
    Location:
    newark notts.
    heres the MA scape with a no.1 in the corner. not too obtrusive

    ignore the WB :oops:

    _MG_8861-01.jpg
     

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