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Help re White Spot

Stu1407

Stu1407

Member
Joined
27 Nov 2018
Messages
114
Location
Wirral UK
Hi Guys,

I wonder if you can help me here. For the first time in donkeys years I have an outbreak of white spot. Looking at the advice on here I ordered some Esha Exit and 2000 which I haven't received yet. In the limited info I have read it suggests using for 3 days.

How does this fit with the life cycle of the parasite which can be anything up to two weeks or does the medication remain in the tank until removed with charcoal and water changes.

My first inclination was actually Paraguard but I was a bit concerned re Seachems advice on its own website about suitability to use in a planted tank.

Any comments or advice welcome.

Thanks
Stu
 
Not sure how it works around the ich lifecycle but it works nonetheless. I guess the trophont stage must last less than 3 days (during which the parasite is less vulnerable to medication) and the medication eradicates the parasite during the remaining tomont and theront phases, when it's at its most vulnerable...
If it's just Ich your fish are suffering there is no need to use 2000 as well, unless it persists or causes a secondary infection. It's also a good idea to give some thought to the possible cause as well so future outbreaks can be avoided.
Don't forget to take in to account the capacity of your filter when calculating the dose.
 
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Thanks for the info. I already have an idea how the outbreak happened and I won't be making the same mistake twice.
 
Duration of treatment seems to depend on fish species
- some have much better apparent immunity to ich, some are seemingly much more capable of mounting a suitable immune response, while for some species it seems a death sentence regardless of medications etc - unless you manage to catch the disease in very early stages; note that even a single external “spot” means LOADS of internal parasites.
If you monitor fish very closely, you will usually see a change in behaviour some time before the first “spot” (but of course the behaviour change may have other underlying causes as well)

AND

Ich strain - Seachem suggests 1 month as that’s what they’ve seen a lot of in recent years .... I was sceptical until I somehow managed to bring some ich home despite no new fish in several months
But I did add plants from a supposed Plant Only tank
And I somehow spread the disease between two tanks before seeing the first spot in Tank 1, a couple days later first spots appeared in Tank 2

I lost a lot of fish over the next THREE months, this strain was medication resistant
After 6 weeks, I finally followed Seachem’s Metronidazole protocols
4 weeks later there were finally no new “spots”
I continued treatment for another 2 weeks

Of course by then all shrimp were lost as well from the continued medication exposure - the Metronidazole quickly ended those remaining
 
Large Daily water changes and wiping down glass and substrate vacuuming definitely helps remove various stages of ich
Then apply medication dose as if Day 1 (again)

Lights off
Increased aeration ie maximize oxygen level in water column
both help
 
See my recent post on the use of glutaldehyde to treat ich.

https://www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/glutaldehyde-for-ick-treatment.56106/#post-545833

According to one aquaculture study evaulating 10+ treatment methods, malachite green is most effective. Most remedies at best can only stop spreading of ich by killing off free swimming larvae. MG can penetrate fish skin and kill off existing ich infection.

Some fish, such as loaches, are more susceptible and are death sentence if not treated early. It takes at least 2 weeks to root out ich even if symptoms are gone. There can be low level of infection inside the mouth and gill of fish that you can’t see, and reappearance of ich is often mistaken as resistant strain or spontaneous outbreak.

My recommended treatment is to treat the entire tank with MG for the first 3 days to strike ich head on, followed by Glut for next 2 weeks to root out surviving larvae even if symptoms are gone. Glut is less toxic to fish, beneficial to plants, and cheaper than MG if you buy the generic. Large WC will help by physically removing the larvae and reset during MG dosing, but not necessary during Glut dosing because Glut is deactivated in 24 hours.

In my trial, Glut at 2 ppm daily is effective in stopping the spread of ich, and my fish can tolerate 6 ppm for an hour long dip and probably long term but I haven’t tried out.

upload_2019-1-1_16-31-54.png
 
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EshaExit is nice as it's fine for shrimps too, you can extend it to 5 days if needed and water change and restart if still not gone. I've not had it come back. It will dye silicone though.
 
tam said:
It will dye silicone though.
Click to expand...
Maybe that's because it contains Malachite Green also. Which would explain how it fits in with the whole life cycle thing.
tiger15 said:
MG can penetrate fish skin and kill off existing ich infection.
Click to expand...
It kills the parasite in all phases of its life cycle.
 
Thanks for the help everyone. Much appreciated by me and also my fish.

Stu
 
Hi
+1 for esha Exit.
Not very convinced that it kills the parasite in stage 1( on fish) tho.
It may take much longer than 3 days too.Recently used it to treat SAP puffers and it took 3-4 weeks to fully get rid of the ich with temperature increase to arround 30°C for the last week or so.Dont bump the temperature right up.A degree or two every few days.
It is good if U can get them to eat some Levimisol medicated food too as this will boost their immune system and speed up recovery.
Have a look here:
https://www.ukaps.org/forum/threads/puffers-with-white-spot.54703/
Regards Konsa
 
Not sure what ingredients of Esha Exi contain. Naming the ingredients is more informative than naming the brand.

If it contains MG, it will stain the water green. MG is absorbed in fish tissue rapidly, and will attack ich in all stages, so raising the temp is not necessary.

Rooting out ich is never a fast process, no less than 2 week in IME. The challenge is to prevent reinfection, because a few unkilled larvae left is sufficient to start all over again if one stops mediation too soon. Overdosing is a concern because MG is slow in degradation so after 3 day treatment, a large WC is needed to continue dosing. I once wiped out all fish by continuing daily dosing for a week without WC.
 
tiger15 said:
Not sure what ingredients of Esha Exi contain. Naming the ingredients is more informative than naming the brand.

If it contains MG, it will stain the water green. MG is absorbed in fish tissue rapidly, and will attack ich in all stages, so raising the temp is not necessary.

Rooting out ich is never a fast process, no less than 2 week in IME. The challenge is to prevent reinfection, because a few unkilled larvae left is sufficient to start all over again if one stops mediation too soon. Overdosing is a concern because MG is slow in degradation so after 3 day treatment, a large WC is needed to continue dosing. I once wiped out all fish by continuing daily dosing for a week without WC.
Click to expand...
Not sure what's in it myself yet. It was recommended on here by lots of people. Unfortunately I spotted the problem on New Years Eve so I am waiting for the delivery from Amazon.
 
If it stains the water green, it contains MG. Not a good idea to wait for mail order delivery. Ich needs to tackled immediately upon first sign of symptom. The longer the wait, the more it spreads, and vulnerable fish, such as loaches, may not survive if treatment is delayed.
 
All ingredients, Acridine, Malachite Green, Meth.Violet, Meth. Blue are fabric dye. So the fish are dyed with rainbow color. Methylene Blue, along with MG, is another very effective ich remedy but isn't used much today due to potential impact on biological media. I believe the cocktail is deadly to ich, but I would use it with caution, do large WC in consecutive dosing to prevent accumulation.
 
Hi
I will advice the op to stick to product guide without overgosing.My puffers are probably more sensitive than the fish to be treated and had amano shrimp in the tank too with no negative impact.I was not able to do as much Water changing as I should as the pufffers are stress Nellies.I will advise full doses only on Waterchange days and half for rest of days till about 10 days after U see fish have cleared completely, wich may be good few weeks untill that happens.In my case while the fish being very greedy ate very wilingly all the time I saw little to no improvement without raised temperature and the thing that really made a huge difference was giving them Levimisol medicated food( big thanks to alto for giving me heads up on that).Saw rapid improvement after that..
Regards Konsa
 
My tank is 325 litres including the filter so I have stuck rigidly to the product guidance. Fortunately the Esha website has a very clear dosege calculator on it. The tank is an interesting shade of bluey green at the moment but that's starting to fade. Ill keep people posted on progress but it's too early to tell yet.
 
Hi
Yes the blue tint will go away.Any white (clear)silicone will get permanently dyed tho.
Regards Konsa
 
Nightmare, I too am suffering white spot.
Is there a treatment that will not dye silicone and is shrimp safe.
Thanks for any advice.
First time in years I’ve had white spot :(
 
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