How to turn my high tech into a low tech?

[Courtneybst]

Hey everyone,

So as the title suggests I currently have a high tech 120P (Tidy Jungle) that's been neglected for various reasons and has a lot of what I think is Spirogyra. Weirdly lots of the plants still look healthy, there just happens to be this algae too.

I want to pull the plug and change the tank to a low tech since it'll be easier to maintain now, but also I'm moving in 6 months time and leaving the tank running with my Mum. Here's what I've planned to do to make the transition, let me know your thoughts on how I should approach this;

Filtration: The tank is very heavily planted and has been running in its current setup since February. The filters themselves (Fluval 307 and Oase Biomaster 850) have been running since February 2021. My understanding is it doesn't really need the additional biological filtration, but it's also moderately stocked with mostly small fish. Full stocking list below:


My Mum won't be able to clean lily pipes and tubing so that leaves hang on back filters which can be easily cleaned and I thought about the Seachem Tidal 110, someone suggested maybe two. An alternative was to change back to stainless steel pipes and leave the pipes uncleaned. I'm not sure what the best approach is here...

Lighting: With it turning to low tech, I had planned to put the Chihiros WRGB Slim 120 back on the tank since it's lower powered than the Week Aqua A430 and will be harder to sell anyways because it can only be used on 120cm tanks.

CO2: I don't think there's any point weaning the plants off, so was just planning to pull the plug. I would remove the fast growing plants and replace with slow growers like crypts and maybe some small echindorus. Minimal trimming is the goal.

Fertiliser: This is another one I'm not sure about. I have an auto doser currently and obviously wouldn't need to dose as much (maybe a 1/4 of my current dosage). However, if I continued the doser I would need to use a pre made shelf stable fertiliser like TNC or Tropica because I won't be there every 30 days to make DIY Ferts. The alternative was to load the substrate up with root tabs and stop water column dosing altogether?

Please let me know your thoughts on these points so this legacy tank can keep running! There's some lovely fish in there that I'd love to see live out their full lives.

 

[_Maq_]

The gravest danger is that your Mum will overfeed. I suppose you know it and took measures to avoid it.

Water changes and fish food will be enough for fertilization. You can throw in an iron nail for long-term iron fertilization. Other nutrients will just re-cycle. Most likely, you'll lose several species, while the rest will thrive.

Also, you can replace canister filters with simple water pumps without any filtration media. That'll make maintenance much easier. Keeping the water moving (and oxygenated) is much more important than supposed biofiltration in canisters.

 

[Wookii]

An alternative was to change back to stainless steel pipes and leave the pipes uncleaned

Yep, do that, or black plastic ones (ala JBL) - I just cleaned my set for the first time in a year after breaking down my holding tank - there wasn't a great deal of mulm in them.

I thought about the Seachem Tidal 110

I'd have thought you'd need at least two if you're using them for flow.

Lighting: With it turning to low tech, I had planned to put the Chihiros WRGB Slim 120 back on the tank since it's lower powered than the Week Aqua A430 and will be harder to sell anyways because it can only be used on 120cm tanks.

Whichever you go for, it'll need turning down quite a bit for low tech as I'm sure you know.

I don't think there's any point weaning the plants off, so was just planning to pull the plug.

I would wean them if you have time. Just gradually turn the CO2 down over a period of time.

However, if I continued the doser I would need to use a pre made shelf stable fertiliser like TNC or Tropica because I won't be there every 30 days to make DIY Ferts.

Tropica is too poor value, you can buy TNC Complete in 5 litre tubs I think. £50+ though 😖 - You could just make up longer lasting bottles of DIY ferts though - just pre-sterlilze the bottles and use potassium sorbate to try maximise the time until mould starts appearing.

The alternative was to load the substrate up with root tabs and stop water column dosing altogether?

I wouldn't recommend that - they tend to just leach into the water column fairly rapidly anyway.

If your Mum is going to struggle to clean filter pipes, is she going to be able to cope with the weekly water changes? 120p - so thats 80 litres odd a week for 25%?

 

[Courtneybst]

The gravest danger is that your Mum will overfeed. I suppose you know it and took measures to avoid it.

Yeah for sure, we've got feedings down since I go away for periods at a time, she knows how much to feed.

Yep, do that, or black plastic ones (ala JBL) - I just cleaned my set for the first time in a year after breaking down my holding tank - there wasn't a great deal of mulm in them.

Ok cool, sounds like less stress!

I would wean them if you have time. Just gradually turn the CO2 down over a period of time.

How long of a period would you recommend? Like a few weeks, few months?

you can buy TNC Complete in 5 litre tubs I think. £50+ though

I don't mind that tbh! Anything to get over mixing ferts. I'm happy to just buy a 5L and let it just sit there until I visit.

If your Mum is going to struggle to clean filter pipes, is she going to be able to cope with the weekly water changes? 120p - so thats 80 litres odd a week for 25%?

Yeah we've got water changes down too, it's quite easy with the pump.

The filter pipe cleaning is quite a hassle on my tank, and the Biomaster in particular is so heavy and doesn't always prime properly etc, just too much hassle lol.

 

[Courtneybst]

Thanks for the help!

 

[Wookii]

How long of a period would you recommend? Like a few weeks, few months?

Just as long as you have available to be honest, anything will be better than just pulling the plug, and will be less likely to end in plant and algae issues I'd wager.

The filter pipe cleaning is quite a hassle on my tank,

I never do it , so I wouldn't know - far too lazy for that 😂

and the Biomaster in particular is so heavy and doesn't always prime properly etc, just too much hassle lol.

If you can teach your Mum to handle cleaning the prefilter every week or two, the main filter shouldn't need touching more than every 6 months, especially on a low tech with no stem plants. Also if you fill the pre-filter cartridge with water before adding the sponges/top section back in, then the filter generally doesn't need re-priming and will work straight away after spitting a few bubbles out.

That said, a couple of HOB's would certainly be a lot easier to maintain. The new (ish) Oase ones are very easy to maintain with their vertically aligned sponge cartridges, but I have had problems with the pump on mine, though I don't think @LondonDragon has had any issues with his so YMMV.

 

[LondonDragon]

The new (ish) Oase ones are very easy to maintain with their vertically aligned sponge cartridges, but I have had problems with the pump on mine, though I don't think @LondonDragon has had any issues with his so YMMV.

Mine has been fine from day one! Just they are a little big size wise, take up a lot of space the 115! But does a great job on my 60l low tech!

 

[_Maq_]

Just as long as you have available to be honest, anything will be better than just pulling the plug, and will be less likely to end in plant and algae issues I'd wager.

Here, you speculate, I suppose.

The filter pipe cleaning is quite a hassle on my tank, and the Biomaster in particular is so heavy and doesn't always prime properly etc, just too much hassle lol.

My favourite topic: Rough mechanical filtration (sponges etc.) and biofiltration are of minor, even disputable importance. Water pump (with venturi) is enough. When you're out, it's a perfect opportunity to give it a try. Will you?

 

[John q]

Here, you speculate, I suppose

I won't put words into wookii's mouth but if you've ever ran a tank with co2 and suddenly cut it (intentionally or not) things generally go to shi@, obviously others milage will vary.

 

[MichaelJ]

I won't put words into wookii's mouth but if you've ever ran a tank with co2 and suddenly cut it (intentionally or not) things generally go to shi@, obviously others milage will vary.

I would say the same. However, quite often a lot of the plants we introduce into our tanks have been grown fully or partially emerged (i.e. access to 420 ppm of CO2), and are still able to adapt fairly quickly to being fully submerged into an environment with hardly any CO2. Of course, growth will be much slower and light intensity will have to be dialed down, gas exchange (including oxygenation) needs to be up to par etc.., but I agree, the better approach would be to slowly ramping off the CO2 over a couple of weeks so the plants can adapt rather than going cold turkey. I often let new plants float around in the tank for a couple of days to alleviate the sting of being deprived of CO2.

@Courtneybst, looking at the plants in the journal (beautiful scape as always btw. ❤️) I don't really see any plants that are high maintenance or absolutely require CO2. A good solution for Mum would be to use something like Tropica specialized (expensive yes, but you don't need much in a stocked low-tech tank if your water is soft and slightly acidic...) and let her dose a few pumps once a week.

Cheers,
Michael

 

[John q]

Hello old (young) bean..

It's the adaptation that's the key. Co2 is indeed a drug, and cold turkey leads to shall we say melting, we've all seen it. Emerged to submersed, high submerged Co2 to low submerged Co2, the plants react, high ferts to low ferts or visa versa, the plants react. Anyone that disputes this is missing the point.

Thankfully plants do adapt and I agree there is nothing in Courtney's tank that can't adapt to low tech.

Slowly, slowly catchy monkey. Lol.

 

[Hanuman]

I will insist on what @Wookii, @John q and @MichaelJ already said. I do recommend you wean CO2 down perhaps for a period of 3-4 weeks. Do that in unison with light. Certain plants will have no problem with a sudden change, others will simply stunt or melt. Same goes for ferts. Don't suddenly change the regime. Wean it down. If your substrate is deep enough you could add a few root tabs on heavy feeding plants as well, just don't over do it. Depending how low tech you want this tank to be and how heavily planted it is, water column fertilization could go as low as once per week.

 

[MichaelJ]

Depending how low tech you want this tank to be

I thought that was a pretty binary proposition; either you inject CO2 (high tech) or you don’t (low tech). If you’re low-tech you really do not need much fertilizers. I wouldn’t even bother with root tabs as this is a pretty well established tank with mature substrate supposedly. As you eventually stop feeding the plants CO2 and dial down the light intensity (and possibly dial down the temperature a bit if possible) the plant’s metabolism will almost grind to a halt, and won’t need much of anything to stay healthy. As we all agree upon, doing this slowly is the key to success.

Cheers,
Michael

 

[Wookii]

Here, you speculate, I suppose.

In part yes, but also because many times I've seen this:

if you've ever ran a tank with co2 and suddenly cut it (intentionally or not) things generally go to shi@

In my own tanks a sudden appearance of algae has lead me to discover an empty CO2 cylinder before I've even noticed the drop checker is back to blue.

I think plants take time to adjust to different prevailing CO2 levels, and whatever the mechanism that causes healthy growing plants to inhibit algae, that mechanism suffers during that adjustment period - so if I was going to remove CO2 from a tank, I'd want that adjustment to be as slow as possible.

 

[Jorge O'Reilly]

You can throw in an iron nail for long-term iron fertilization.

Whoa hang on. Is this a thing? Just tossing a nail in?

 

[John q]

Whoa hang on. Is this a thing?

Lol, we have a thread.

If I were to add a chunk of iron to the tank...

You know, let us say a 50 pence piece size of iron ore, would that slowly release iron to the tank? I could swear, I was told as a kid to add an iron nail to my aquariums...

www.ukaps.org

 

[LondonDragon]

@Courtneybst you need to pop over and have a look at my 4 low tech tanks that run with hardly any maintenance, you can also see what type of plants do well

 

[Jorge O'Reilly]

Lol, we have a thread.

If I were to add a chunk of iron to the tank...

You know, let us say a 50 pence piece size of iron ore, would that slowly release iron to the tank? I could swear, I was told as a kid to add an iron nail to my aquariums...

www.ukaps.org

Adding rusty nails to my shopping cart, thanks.

Edit: I'll post the questions here, since that thread is old and frankly got a bit theological towards the end. The likelihood of overdosing is low, right? Put another way, rust and "raw" iron before being available through microbial activity is relatively harmless to stock and plants with any "sensible" amounts. That said, surface area must also be important, I suppose. So say ten grams of iron in the shape of a single nail would be less effective than straight iron powder mixed into the substrate.

 

[MichaelJ]

Adding rusty nails to my shopping cart, thanks.

Edit: I'll post the questions here, since that thread is old and frankly got a bit theological towards the end. The likelihood of overdosing is low, right? Put another way, rust and "raw" iron before being available through microbial activity is relatively harmless to stock and plants with any "sensible" amounts. That said, surface area must also be important, I suppose. So say ten grams of iron in the shape of a single nail would be less effective than straight iron powder mixed into the substrate.

I've heard about the rusty nails before... it's just as unpredictable as relying on leaching hardscape (rocks) to remineralize your water ... which is another thing I recently saw recommended somewhere. I am not a nail expert, but nails are very likely to contain relatively high percentages of Nickel, Chromium and possibly Copper. You don't want any of these elements in excess in your aquarium, especially if you have invertebrates. But even if that wouldn't be an issue, how do you manage the Fe dosing with rusty nails ? Just too many outs on this idea Instead, I would at least use some super slow release iron tabs made for aquarium applications.

Cheers,
Michael

 

[Conort2]

I pulled the plug with co2 on my tank immediately following a co2 disaster (gassed fish near death) and can’t remember there being any major problems with algae. Although if you have the time to do it I’d definitely recommend slowly ramping it down over say the period of a few weeks if you can.

I kept my lighting levels the same, however they weren’t what I’d call high tech lighting levels anyway. A 3 foot twinstar s hanging over a 5 foot tank set at 50 percent.

Dosing is around a quarter to a third ei levels, I’m not very precise. I also dose liquid carbon as I can get issues with bba in certain areas otherwise. I may back off from the liquid carbon soon though as the tank seems to be pretty settled and mature now.

Water changes are at least 50 percent weekly, with filters cleaned weekly if I can. My fish stock is a lot higher than yours though so it is necessary. Although I’m a big advocate of water changes and don’t think you can ever do too many.

I much prefer the slower pace of the plants with low tech and I do not miss the constant trimming and having to keep on top of things. All I do now is pull the odd manky leaf off a crypt and make sure I keep the nymphaea in check.

Cheers