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Confusion over EI and Water Changes

K

Kam Sandhu

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Joined
11 Aug 2014
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112
Hi all.

The time is almost here for me to attempt a low tech tank.

I am trying to get my head around EI dosing and water changes. I have read conflicting things.

I plan to plant heavy, so 80 - 85% of the substrate will be covered (attempt to carpet).

I have a Juwel Rio 180 and about 25/ 30 small fish (this can be increased if needed).

I am using eco complete as the substrate, so, do I need to use ferts? Or do the fish provide the nutrients for the plants? And are water changes still needed?
 
Fish can provide nutrient for the plants BUT must keep the light level down to low levels. I ran for years with Juwel Vision 180 and its T8 tubes with no reflectors, firmly in low light category, changing water....when ever time allowed. Plants grew, slowly and no algae at all.

Increased light levels, makes the plants grow faster, they will then need fertiliser and CO2 and frequent water changes to get rid of the waste.

The chart below from http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/showthread.php?t=105774 is a rough handy guide to light level.

PARvsDistVariousBulbs2.jpg
 
Thanks for the info.

I have 2 x 54w T5 high lite bulbs. I was planning to keep them on for 6 hours a day. Would this be ok?
 
These are definitely in the high light territory, guessing your tank, like mine is about 50cm deep.

If you want low tech, remove reflectors, raise the lights, put tape/foil on the tubes, put diffuser under the tubes, single tube (if possible) and say 3-4 hours a day and see what happens. May or may not require small doses of additional carbon (liquid carbon fine) and fertilisers. These are bright tubes.

If you want high tech, especially carpeting plants, then full light, reflectors, CO2 injection, 1800litre/hr flow rate, EI dosing and weekly water changes is way to go.
 
Oh great.

I have no reflectors, just a bog standard setup.

I want to stick with low tech.

Whats the best course of action?

The tank is 50cm deep and the light unit doesnt allow it to run on 1 light.

I dont mind reducing lights to 3/4 hours.
 
Try 3-4 hours and see what happens, plants will grow slowly, but if you are planting so many plants you will need to supplement with carbon source and fertiliser.

My mate changed fro T8 to T5, plants went ballistic, consumed all the food, melted away and waste consumed by algae. Ended up with completely green algae filled tank as light level and time (10hours) was in high tech. So he covered tube, darkened plastic sheet under the lights and reduced lighting time, now adds small doses of liquid carbon and small doses of EI ferts (scrounged from me as cheaper than buying some) and plants grow and no algae.
 
Sorry I made a mistake, I have 2 x 45w, does this make much difference.
 
Damn.

Right, so if I plant heavy, 3/4 hours of light. Do I need to dose ferts?

Looking on other forums it seems it is possible with the T5s
 
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It is perfectly possible with T5 (no reflectors) to grow healthy plants. Just keep on period short'ish (3/4 hours) and dose ferts, as if heavily planted fish waste won't be enough.
 
Obviously you don't dose ferts & carbon in EI quantities, just have to try and see. My mate doses 1/4 dose liquid carbon and 1/4 dose of EI liquid and plants look fine (but not bright :D) with his single T5
 
ian_m said:
Obviously you don't dose ferts & carbon in EI quantities, just have to try and see. My mate doses 1/4 dose liquid carbon and 1/4 dose of EI liquid and plants look fine (but not bright :D) with his single T5
Click to expand...

Great that has confused me. I bought a starter kit from plant food UK. Is that no good?

Or do I just dose a smaller quantity than on the recipe sheet?
 
Kam Sandhu said:
Or do I just dose a smaller quantity than on the recipe sheet?
Click to expand...
Yes. Remember you will need a carbon source.

The amount you need to dose unknown, just need to try and see as it depends on your light level and/or on times.

EI is all about not having to know how much the plants require, the original research proved that EI dosing and monsterous light levels (and CO2) the plants could take in any more. Thus EI doses more than the plants could ever use. To prevent excess build up (of ferts and plant waste) over time you change 50% water weekly.
 
Kam Sandhu said:
So basically go high tech?
Click to expand...
Yes, high tech, if you want quick lush plant growth and can grow the more difficult types of plants and want bright lights.

Otherwise control your reduced light level and dose small amounts of carbon and ferts.

When things go wrong high tech, it happens very quickly, plants melt in a day, algae appears very quickly, almost daily. This is one of the reasons people struggle with high tech getting it right.

When things go wrong low tech (low light) it all happens a lot slower, maybe in week timescales.
 
I don't want to go high tech.

I think I'll start small.

Will liquid carbon be ok?
 
The EI started kit you bought is just fine, just dose 1/4 of the amount that is recommended in the packaging, and the same goes for liquid carbon; instead of 1 ml. per 50 ltr., dose 1 ml. per 200 ltrs. This will technically still be a high tech tank by the way, since you will be supplementing ferts and a form of carbon. This will also mean that you will have to do water changes at LEAST once every 2 weeks, around 30% minimum, to rid the water of the waste materials. The thing that is dictating that, is the amount of light you are injecting; more light for the plants, means they need more ferts and CO2 to use all that light to grow healthy; if ferts and CO2 are missing, algae WILL take over.

The suggested light period of 4 hours is the absolute MINIMUM as far as duration is concerned, since the plants need at least 4 hours of light to get their photosynthesis going; I would rather suggest 6 hours of light. And if you do really want to go low tech, you will have to address the amount of light; this would mean decreasing the intensity of the lamps by around 30-50%, by the methods suggested earlier (diffusion films, et cetera).
 
Kam Sandhu said:
Will liquid carbon be ok?
Click to expand...
Yes, absolutely fine.

My mate was dosing 1/4 amount (1ml for his 200l) every day he remembers to feed fish (doses ferts as well). Changes some water every couple of weeks. Again low tech so all happens slowly. His single T5 is 4 hours a day and has a sheet of darkened plastic in between light and tank.
 
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