Do I really need CO2 for my 200l tank? & if so how much?

[Jafooli]

Hi

So I'm a bit stressed out and depressed at the moment lol and I'm not as knowledgeable or experienced as you guys so I need some help please.

Tank: 200l 2x T8 bulbs, 2x internal filters. Fluval u4's
Ammonia 0ppm
Nitrite 0ppm
Nitrate 40ppm
PH 7.4
TDS 476
KH 12
GH 21

Dose EI pre mixed, and do not use KNO3, K2SO4 for potassium.

So my tank was fine & algae free, I said I want more growth especially on my carpeting plants, cranked CO2 up, and boom algae outbreak, system crashed literally, all my carpet plants now covered in brown algae, crypts and echinodorus plants eating them selfs, green smudge and brown smudge stuff all on my tank glass, tank & plants were took over with algae, green spot algae on all plants, glass. Just a total mess.

CO2 before was at 1.8bps, I upped it to 2.6, algae outbreak happens, so did I add to much CO2? so much that the algae started to benefit it more? Another good thing to point out is, my tank is low light, low demanding plants..... I am only trying my luck with carpeting plants.... so maybe there was just to much?

Anyway few days ago noticed clown loach acting weird, other fish gasping, CO2 somehow turned it's self up to 3bps, lol, from charts I think I might of been in the 90ppm area, anyway I've lowered it all the way down to a new lowest, 1.5bps, and not sure if regulator is stable, but at the moment it is.

Now when I look back I think I was stupid, example if tank 1 had high light, high demanding plants and fast growers... articles and people say online aim for 30ppm.. so in this high spec tank it has 30ppm of CO2 .... great, tank 2 (my tank) low light, low demanding plants, I have 30ppm of CO2, what happens here?? surely my tank don't benefit the same? my plants will use less co2?

I'm nearly overstocked with fish as it is, so if I removed my CO2, would they give enough co2 to my tank? my girlfriends fluval ebi has no co2, no ferts, but yet plants grow, slow but grow.

Obviously I want to achieve the best growth and give my plants everything they need, but I'm just confused, I'm not blessed with a high end tank with high lights, and high demanding plants, I would much prefer a tank like that, but sadly I got to make do for now, and everything I learned is from the internet and forums like this one

So where did this algae outbreak come from? & do I need CO2? if so how much?

I hope someone can help me, or give me some advice, I just don't know what to do, and don't get me wrong I really enjoy growing plants and this hobby, but my tank is just depressing me at the moment, I guess I might of reached the point off, I want better lights, high demanding plants and not crypts etc, but If I can get this sorted I know I can enjoy my tank again with out upgrading etc, as I can't afford that now and this is a new 200l tank I just feel like I have no idea what I'm doing no more, I'm questioning my self

 

[kirk]

I'm thinking water changes, and ferts?

 

[Jafooli]

Hi ya kirk,

My normal routine is 50% w.c every Sunday, while I'm not great at all this EI dosing, I once learnt how to understand the dosing calculators about a year ago, but when I compared it to the guidelines of where I purchased my starter kit and what they recommended, I found most of my Macro's were in the weekly PPM range.

Macro: 500ml water
1tsp Potassium Phosphate
6tsp Magnesium Sulfate
I removed the Potassium Nitrate and use Potassium Sulfate, I dose 3/4 dry.

Micro - 1tsp APF Chelated Trace - 500ml water.

10ml per 50ltr they recommended , I dose 40ml

So yeah this has worked fine for me, but ever since I upped the CO2, the algae just took over in like a few days. Its started to get better over the last couple of days, but still there.

 

[kirk]

I'm puzzled as I've had the same problems recently which in the end had me ripping everything out and starting again. After trying black out etc I gave up. I have found in high flow areas and high co2 I get algae complete opposite of what I was led to believe. I change our water 3-4 Times a week with Ro but only 25-50 ltrs at a time on a 120 ltr. my sons low Tec tank is slow but spotless with few water changes. The tank I first mentioned Is now drifting towards low Tec. I'm sorry I dont have a strait helpfull answer for you but as you probably know clives your man to wait for.

 

[ceg4048]

Ripping everything out and starting again is always a bad practice. The results will always be the same unless the hobbyist changes and learns how to exercise some level of control.

The answer to these questions are obvious. The OP assumes that the nutrient levels in the tank are high, ans this assumption is based on useless test kit reading. So he believes his test kit and instead of dosing the proper NO3 nutrient levels he substitutes a nutrient powder that he doesn't really need.

Read this thread Potting soil, co2, crypts and no ferts | UK Aquatic Plant Society

Then you will see that when you substitute powders without ever knowing the truth of what's in the water, it leaves you vulnerable to nutrient deficiency.

As mentioned in that thread when you limit the amount of CO2 you then limit the uptake requirement of the nutrients. When you then remove the CO2 limitation, this drives a higher uptake requirement for nutrients. High CO2 therefore exposes the fact that the nutrient levels are low, and so the plants suffer nutrient deficiency.

Cheers,

 

[Jafooli]

Hi thanks for the replies,

My brain don't have the capacity to understand everything 100% lol, so I do try my best and I apologize in advance.

So I read the thread you posted, and I presume from what I read is that when I turned my CO2 up, there just wasn't enough nutrients in the water column, hence the deficiencies I started to see and organic waste build up on the plant leafs which leads me to.....

Can I presume all the brown smudgy algae that started to appear on all my leafs and glass, was actually the plant waste from where I turned the CO2 up to much which therefore made the plants produce waste quicker?

I think that's how I understood it from what I read in that thread, "more light, co2, nutrients etc more organic waste"

So that would explain why my tank was working better at 1.8bps of CO2, as the speed and balance of the tank was much better?

Or am I totally wrong about this? and I need to read that thread a few mores times lol.

If that was how all the algae appeared then great, I can hopefully solve and fix my tank, I've already lowered the CO2, so hopefully the plants will use the nutrient's a bit slower and not use them all up.

Also like I said my tank is close to being overstocked, so I have a wide range of fish, if I was to stop CO2 injection, could I still dose ferts at a lower dose, and my tank would still be fine? just much slower growth rates etc?

I've also noticed I've got two fish that are ill, they are struggling to breath, and are also struggling to even swim correctly, there at the bottom gasping for oxygen, they then hang at the surface trying to get oxygen, I already noticed gasping hence why I checked my bubble rate and noticed it was to high, I think it might be to late for them, I'm so disappointed in my self, and feel like I've let my fish down tbh, I just hope my other fish can pull through as I did notice a lot of gasping....

Also Clive the last time you helped me was with my light and GH & KH, my GH was 16 and KH 8 at that time, we came to somewhat of a conclusion it could of been my Eco Complete that raised the GH and KH so high, since then my GH and KH are now.... 21GH and 12KH why would they of gone even more higher? I don't understand? I thought after a few months they would of gone down dramatically, its probably making issues for my fish and my tempts in breeding some, I don't like it being this high, I don't come across many if any people with it this high, not even my girlfriends tank in the same house is even close to how high mine are, and in her tank I do get normal nitrate readings.... which leads me to...

I have tried so many Nitrate kits, I know or think you hate them and test kits lol, but my water report, ( South East Water) says its 50 mg NO3/I, I think 50ppm? and in my tank I'm sure the test kits say its around 30-40ppm its in the red either way, and I've tried with 3 different API kits, that's why I don't dose nitrate, so you think I should just forgot the kit and dose nitrate? and not worry about nitrate poisoning or anything? I will take your advice over mine, so please let me know, and I can keep an eye on fish If I do go down that route.

I also don't think my dosing is to much of a concern, I think its more CO2, I hope I'm correct in saying my tank will benefit much more now I've turned my CO2 down.
Hope you can help.

Thanks.

 

[ceg4048]

Well, the plants have just told you that you do not have 50ppm and that you don't even have 30-40ppm. I'm pretty sure I would have mentioned to you that nitrate poisoning is an illusion spread by the people who sell nitrate test kits. NO3 test kits are the worst of the worst, so if you want to spend you energy fretting over NO3 If you still believe in this myth, then simply keep the CO2 low and that will throttle down the nutrient uptake demand.

As far as the hardness and alkalinity, again, this is something that I never worry about and I've run tanks with numbers higher than what you report without any problems, but then again, I've not worried about breeding. For breeding, if you have specific requirements or objectives then you'll need to cut the water with RO. You also might have some form of Calcium/Magnesium and Carbonates in your hardscape or substrate that is dissolving into the water.

Cheers,

 

[Jafooli]

Thanks Clive for taking your time to help.

I will try and keep it short and simple, can you just confirm something for me, before I give my self false confidence.

You mention this equation in the thread you linked me and the paragraphs below kind of confirm what I'm about to ask but just want to make sure I'm correct as like I'm said I'm not the most intelligent.
The equation: Light===>CO2>==>Nutrients=>Growth Rate=>Organic Waste.

So I always assumed when people use CO2, every person with there tank should aim for 30ppm, but from what I think you have taught me is that's not case, if your light is not as high, so on the lower side like mine, I can then lower my CO2, which then allows me to lower my dosing, which then will also lower the organic waste my plants produces, yey lol, am I right? I know you didn't specifically mention low/high light, but obviously a high light tank, the plants there are going to benefit more with higher co2 and a higher dosing regime and the tank overall will require more maintenance.

Also can you secondly confirm what all the brown stuff is that over took my tank and plants leaves?, am I correct in saying this was organic waste the plant produced due to me increasing the CO2? and because I probably didn't have the best flow like a high spec tank would it managed to take hold?, I then also started to see nutrient defiances because off the increase off CO2, therefore driving the nutrient uptake.

I think that's how I understood your equation, so for me personally I now know I don't have to achieve 30ppm for a great tank as there are other matters to take into account..... my goal like you mention in the thread also is to have a more low maintenance tank, still with weekly 50% w.c just less nutrient dosing, and much less co2 being added. I think this would benefit my tank especially with the kind of plants I have, crypts, low light also, so it would make sense to have the CO2 a bit lower, other wise I'm make it hard for my self like I soon found out when I increased it.

So to clarify basically lower co2, means nutrients will be used much slower, therefore you can cut back a bit on nutrients, and the plants will produce less organic waste, increase the co2 and the opposite happens, and that's probably why I had loads of defiances appear and lots of brown crap on my plants from the organic waste.

Thanks again for ya help, so hope you can quickly confirm I'm on the right path, or tell me I'm totally wrong lol.

I also need to make a separate thread as it seems my regulator is increasing its bps on its own, it slowly increases over time, and I'm needing to re-adjust it each day, so will need to sort that out now !!

 

[ian_m]

Also can you secondly confirm what all the brown stuff is that over took my tank and plants leaves

Diatoms is usual brown stuff.
James' Planted Tank - Algae Guide. Generally will go away as tank matures and/or will be scoffed by fish like otto's.

therefore you can cut back a bit on nutrients,

Don't reduce, nutrients are cheap, dose as per EI, that way you know the ppm. No test kits needed. Too much won't harm fish or plants. I had over 300ppm nitrate in my tank for a couple of days after a pump failure, fish fine, plants fine, no algae. Reducing nutrients is the start of the slippery slope to problems.

A also need to make a separate thread as it seems my regulator is increasing its bps on its own, it slowly increases over time, and I'm needing to re-adjust it each day, so will need to sort that out now !!

You have a leak somewhere.

 

[ceg4048]

Hiya mate,
Yes, your understanding is correct. Using CO2 doesn't mean you have to max everything out, so you don't need high light because light acts as a throttle, and in that equation, as you lower the light then you immediately lower the need to have high CO2 and high nutrients. Of course there is a range of required nutrients for each level of CO2. It's not one value of nutrients for one value of CO2.

Unfortunately, you upset the apple cart when you increased the gas. You drove the equation to the right, but your nutrition was lower than the minimum required. If, for example, you increased the injection rate again, but this time increased the dosing levels, then there would be no problems. You were not dosing the scheduled amounts, so when you increased the CO2 the wheels fell off the wagon because there was not enough nutrition to support the increased amount of CO2.

The brown debris could easily be some kind of diatomic algae, there are thousands of varieties, or it could be a combination of waste and algae. It's difficult to tell without any sort of images, but I tend to think it's a type of diatom. Just do more water changes and make sure you wipe that stuff off the surface. If it does not come off easily then it's some type of Green Spot Algae (GSA). More water changes/cleaning and more dosing will sort that out in short order. Then, if you wish, you can lower the nutrient level again.

I can't tell what's happening with your regulator. Is the content of the cylinder getting near empty? Sometimes, when the bottle is low on CO2 the gas escapes more quickly. You may just need to re-fill. Normally, one has to open the needle vale as time goes on, but as you approach empty the gas escapes and rushes out. I don't know for sure if that's your case.

Cheers,

 

[Jafooli]

Hey Ian and Clive,

Ah my head feels cleared now, its good to know I understood correct, I now have some self belief again.

Everything you just said above is exactly how I am thinking right now, so I'm finally on the right wave length.

Also Ian you mention not to reduce, the only reason I want to is, I was dosing 28ml of Macro/Micro into my tank on alternative days and my tank and plants were doing fine! , and I then upped the CO2 for more growth, and all these problems occurred which I now know why , anyway I upped the dosing all the way to 40ml, which is what's recommended from the place I purchased my starter kit but I managed to find the 28ml mark from my own experience worked great, but like mentioned above, the CO2 just upset the apple cart as clive says lol, so now I've lowered my CO2, I can hopefully slowly get back to my old routine, and even lower the co2 a bit more to keep things more easy for my self, and yeah your correct there not to expensive, so I can hopefully just go around 30ml mark, but will keep at 40ml for now, I just like to get the extra week out of it. :L

My CO2 FE is around the 5.5kg mark when I last checked which was a few days ago so it has maybe a couple more weeks life before I change, I never had this problem with my old FE when it got low, so I'm not convinced that's the problem, hopefully its a leak like Ian mentioned, I did change some tubing, and I changed my check valve, but its still increasing really slowly, grrrr.. If it's not a leak, and cylinder issue, what can I do next?

Also I hope this helps you confirm what algae I had, or if it was organic waste, also to point out these plants were green and healthy before I increased co2, but we now know what happened, and as you can cleary see there are some deficiencies in the pictures, potassium being one of them, but the brown stuff I have no idea, and If it is diatoms then I'm even more confused, as my tank is fully matured, and the way it took over my tank in a matter of days after increasing CO2, makes me think it has to be something else?





Oh I also did about 30% w.c today to help, and my next major w.c is Sunday, my tank looks 70% better already, my stauro repens does not look as good as it use to, but also don't look as bad as the picture anymore, I just hope this all clears up, and my otto's are lazy lol, I also did add 10 root tabs today to help as-well, and I've been removing any leafs with green spot on them, and I tried to rub as much off my stauro repens but the leafs are so tiny its quite hard to get them all.

Once again thanks Clive for confirming that for me, its so much better when you understand things.

 

[ceg4048]

Yeah, that's algae. Definitely GSA.
GSA is caused by any combination of low CO2 and low PO4. Since you had an increase in CO2 it's logical to conclude that the CO2 increase exposes low PO4.

You need to remove all those leaves immediately. Hack away until all is clear and resume your previous regime. Or, if you cannot control the injection rate increase then you have little choice but to increase the dosing of ALL nutrients until you solve the gas issue.

It could be that there is some debris trapped in the regulator causing an internal leakage.

Cheers,

 

[Jafooli]

Ah right that's good to know I already suspected it was GSA on the stem plant and have already removed the leafs ,its also a nightmare to clean of the glass, I clean it every week, I guess everyone gets it on there glass

Well hopefully now I've lowered the CO2, my tank can start to sort its self out, and I will keep dosing on the higher side for now and most likely just keep it that way.

I checked the BPS today, and its pretty much fine, I've ordered a new bubble counter, co2 tubing, and if that don't solve the issue, hopefully someone can let me know how I check for any debris in the regulator. I hope its just a leak. If it were a leak I presume the leak has to be before the bubble counter? as how would a leak further up the system cause a fluctuation in the bps? The increase is so small I set it at 1.2 bps, it moved to 1.23 yesterday and this morning its 1.25, but obviously its still a issue as it keeps rising, for example when I set it at 2.6bps and it made its way to 3bps.

I also presume the brown dust on my repens and glosso was just diatoms then? still strange how they appeared as my tank is fully matured, and its now nearly ruined all them plants leafs, although its slowly disappearing.

Anyway thanks again for everyone's help and being patient with me, and hopefully I'm now back on track!

 

[Jafooli]

Hey just a update on my situation, my main problem now is the diatoms but to start here is the situation now with my CO2.

I received my new up bubble counter and polyurethane co2 tubing, I hooked it all up on Monday, its still fluctuating by an extra bubble every time the regulator switches on, which is the same pattern as what was happening before, just a bit less now.

Here is an example and bearing in mind I am aiming for around 1bps to keep things easy for now:
Monday 58 bubbles per minute, turned co2 off then on to test stability, it increased to 60 bubbles.
Tuesday co2 on, 61 bubbles,
Wednesday co2 on, 62 bubbles.

So its increasing much less but still slowly increasing, I have no idea what's going on, I'm 99% sure its no leak, I keep the system short and simple so it would be easier to detect any leaks and I can't, I guess one thought that passed my mind was when the CO2 system turns on the initial burst is somehow tweaking the needle valve that tiny bit, if that's possible? I know the FE is on the lower side and will need replacing soon, but didn't think it was low enough to cause this problem. If anyone knows anything I could try please let me know, my plan for now is to use the FE another 2 weeks or so, then replace and see how the problem goes on a brand new FE, if its still happening I can contact the manufacturer and see what they recommend.

Now for the main issue, which I don't want anyone or Clive feel the need to repeat them self's, as I think so far that's probably been the case with me, So luckily I found this thread with some research Diatom dilemma... | UK Aquatic Plant Society which has been a great read and some others, which leads me to believe Diatoms can also appear because of to much light. I know my tank is fully matured, and these diatoms were never a issue before, and I'm not sure its my light either, it must be one of the two though, or something else I've missed when reading.

I presume from other threads as-well, a good plan of action for me would be to do a blackout for 4 days? but I don't want to do that then have it all come back again, so what's the most likely cause of the diatoms in my tank? when the plants got weakened, has the diatoms just took a hold? when they get a hold do they just keep spreading/multiplying? they are still appearing on new healthy growth. I've also read any change you do in your tank , aka, increase ferts, co2, it can take up to three weeks for the differences to be seen, so am I just going have to wait a bit more longer? but obviously my main concern is its just infecting my new growth and therefore weakening the leafs and killing them.

Does my tank just need the reset button pushed? aka blackout, and then hopefully my plants can start to adapt to the new environment changes?

I feel like I'm in such a lower league to everyone else on here, I mean any plant in my tank, all I have to do is Google it or look at others people's tanks, and I see a totally different healthy plant, I cant take it no more. I need to step up and I need to step up fast. I've re-educated my self this past week and tried to refresh my memory. I want to grow the perfect glosso or stauro repens, stem plants not a bunch of sorry looking plants, the only plants doing great are my crypts.

So I hope you can help me Clive, and let me know how I can eradicate these diatoms, so I can get to work on growing my plants again, I know its not as easy as just dosing fertilizers and adding co2 to get a healthy looking plant/tank, but I do plan to raise my game and concentrate on getting my ferts, co2, flow, maintenance to a much better balance, I know my flow could do with improving at the bottom of the tank. I also don't think my ceramic diffuser is the worlds best, I still get lots of CO2 reaching the surface, but I will keep trying to improve these.

 

[ceg4048]

Hi mate,
Yeah I would just do a huge water change, then do the blackout and carry on. It's really not that big of a deal. Turn off CO2 and dose nutrients just before. Then just cover the tank and wait.

You need to be sure that it's diatomic algae though. If the algae comes off easy when you wipe the leaf between your thumb and forefinger then it's most likely diatoms, but if it's rough and doesn't come off then it's most likely some kind of Green Spot Algae (GSA) even if it's brown and not green.

Cheers,

 

[Jafooli]

Cheers Clive,

Yeah its rubbing off from the Glosso, but even then the leafs are still quite damaged, and I can't rub it all off. So I'll do a W/C today, and do I dose the Macro and Micro together after? or just stick to the Macro? as that's what I normally dose after w/c...

I'll also add my air pump in and raise my filters to provide more oxygen. Thanks for the quick reply, and will update after blackout lol.

 

[Jafooli]

Tank is in blackout mode, I just hope there is no light entering through the black bags, I've gave it 3 coats all the way around, I raised both filters to provide loads of surface movement and chose to leave the small air pump out. I hope my fish will be aright, I cant see how the oxygen is going to enter the tank through all them bags? like once the oxygen gets used up, where will it replenish? probably such a dumb question, but hope that makes sense. I did a blackout before on a smaller tank but had a air pump in that time around, so I hope the fish will be aright and really hope no light can get through, probably going to keep my room as dark as possible as-well, dam its a depressing room in there right now, not sure what's worse to look at bin bags or algae.

Fingers crossed until Sunday afternoon.

 

[ceg4048]

There will be no problems getting O2 into the tank. It's not air tight. You can use air pump in there if it will be too stressful.​

​

Cheers,​

 

[Jafooli]

Hey Clive

Just an update, I've done the 4 day blackout, the tank has improved overall considerably, I see some GSA still remains but all diatoms are gone. Its made such a difference, I can finally see green leafs again. I presume GSA can survive a blackout better than other algae's, diatoms?

I also do suffer from BBA, only on my wood or filter outlet, I already know a blackout can't kill it, hardly much can, but how come it can survive a blackout? I'm sure you've probably mentioned that on here somewhere, so if you can point me there, or just let me know that would be great as I'm quite interested to know, also if a tank was being pumped with oxygen would this kill the BBA, as my girlfriends tank has it as-well, but I've added a air pump in there, and it seems the BBA is actually shrinking in size. Reason I ask is I read its caused because of fluctuations in CO2, so a tank full of oxygen would have less fluctuation?

Anyway below is some new pictures, the plants look much better, I uncovered the tank and did a 50% water change, I made a new Macro and Micro solution last night, I also added a little extra of each nutrient to the mix, and added half the recommended dose of KNO3, as you know I normally leave this out and dose K2SO4 for the potassium as the test kit says I have high nitrate, but yes I know there wrong now, thanks to your help, but just to be on the safe side I only added half, and will continue adding K2SO4 as I normally do, so now I should have extra nutrients in my solutions and I will continue to dose the full amount. Then at least I know I will have no deficiency problems, aka this GSA is annoying, I presume its from low phosphates so hopefully that will eliminate that problem. Also out of curiosity I read multiple times you say KNO3 is not harmful to fish, how high does KNO3 have to be before it would do harm? say 70ppm for example or even 100ppm.

I also bleached my diffuser all day yesterday where as I normally bleach it for an hour, I left pure thick bleach on it for hours, when I fired it up today, It worked better than what it did when I purchased it brand new, I'm not sure if your meant to bleach them brand new? but its never worked so good, Its like literally pure mist, I can't even see any bubbles, its like I've gone out and purchased a £40 diffuser!

I've lowered one filter to provide more flow to the bottom area of my tank, and I've highered one and that's producing mid-top flow around the tank with some surface ripple, I've pointed both filters in the same direction to act like a river, the CO2 is getting pushed around much better than what it was especially now its actually a mist rather than fine bubbles. I still think there is more room for improvement with my flow, especially around the bottom of my tank so maybe it would be worth looking into a decent powerhead which can be rotated.

I will also continue to work on my CO2 diffusion and monitor it everyday to see how stable it is, and if its still un-stable I will order a new FE and see if that fixes it. If I start the week at 1BPS, and at the end of the weeks its 1.3BPS, what kind of problems would I expect to hit? more algae? BBA? or is .3 an acceptable fluctuation? I Would be interested to know just encase I can't solve the issue straight away? I don't want to go down that route so I am going to try to get that solved so I can do everything the best I can, and that's also to keep focusing on good constant CO2, and good flow distribution, and there's not much I can do about light as its a Fluval roma tank, but the more I read, I can presume there is more room for error with T8's.

Here are the pictures, as expected the plants have cleaned up quite nice:

I've still got a lot more maintenance to do, the odd one or two leafs still need taking out, I've done so much today, but then when you sit and have a look you notice more things which need pruning or picking out lol.

Thanks again for all your help and putting me back on track, I think the main thing I've took away is that not everyone needs to pump in 30ppm of CO2, and the lower the CO2, the less harder your plants work and the slower they will take up the nutrients. I think that's going to help me a lot to combat these deficiency problems, and then I can concentrate more on CO2, Flow, and hopefully get a algae free tank with thriving plants!

If that still don't work out for me in the future I'm sure your then point out the problem for me, but for now I feel more prepared than I was before. I just hope I can get these harder carpeting plants to thrive now, I also presume from what I've read light is not much of an issue and its more of the driving force, so If I get everything balanced, co2, flow, nutrients etc, there should be no issue regarding light? just that they will grow slower, as the driving force of my tank will be much lower than that of a higher lit tank. ( I did read the article you wrote about the car being the light, something similar, so that's how I understood it lol )

Light is still my weak point, but I think its safe to say I can still grow plants successfully if I keep everything running smoothly, but on the other hand maybe I am wrong, and my bulbs are pretty useless for carpeting plants. I know it won't be as easy, but in regards to everything else, it should give me more room for error as everything in my tank will be being used less like in your digram: Light===>CO2>==>Nutrients=>Growth Rate=>Organic Waste.

Thanks again, for all your help and time.

 

[ceg4048]

Anyway below is some new pictures, the plants look much better, I uncovered the tank and did a 50% water change, I made a new Macro and Micro solution last night, I also added a little extra of each nutrient to the mix, and added half the recommended dose of KNO3, as you know I normally leave this out and dose K2SO4 for the potassium as the test kit says I have high nitrate, but yes I know there wrong now, thanks to your help, but just to be on the safe side I only added half, and will continue adding K2SO4 as I normally do, so now I should have extra nutrients in my solutions and I will continue to dose the full amount.

Safe side of what? I don't get this. Nitrogen is the Number 2 most important element and Potassium is down at Number 4, so I see no point in using half of the required dosages for N and increasing K. I have no idea what the toxic level of NO3 is in a tropical tank. I've dosed up to 100ppm without issues. London Dragon made a miscalculation and did 10X EI dosing for a while before realizing his error. That means he was dosing around 200ppm. Whatever the toxic value is for NO3 we won't get anywhere near it. If you have high NO3 because you are not cleaning the tank, then that is a different story entirely, but even in that case, the damage is being done by the dirt. The NO3 is merely the smoking gun that happens afterwards.

Furthermore, If you have GSA and if it's suspected that it is due to low PO4, then you need to be adding a lot more PO4. This is another reason the extra K2SO4 addition is so perplexing. The more you fear nutrients the more problems you will have because the tank is obviously screaming for more PO4 and you are putting in extra K, which can make the plant demand even more PO4.

In picture #1 above you need to thin out that bed and redistribute the plants. This opens up flow/distribution within the bed and helps the plant to recover. Continue to remove all damaged leaves.

Some algal forms are more resistant to blackout. It's not clear why. It might be due to higher levels of starch reserves or it may be more complicated than that. No dissolved gas affects the behavior of any other gas dissolved in that same water, so there is no point thinking about killing BBA with Oxygen. During water change, you can spot treat using Hydrogen peroxide, or Sodium perchlorate ( a better option) or spot treat with Excel the remove the BBA from hardscape.

I will also continue to work on my CO2 diffusion and monitor it everyday to see how stable it is, and if its still un-stable I will order a new FE and see if that fixes it. If I start the week at 1BPS, and at the end of the weeks its 1.3BPS, what kind of problems would I expect to hit? more algae? BBA? or is .3 an acceptable fluctuation?

Well, I really don't think that looking at the bubble rates is the way to approach this. You really need to focus more on the pH profile throughout the day and to look deeper into the reasons for any anomalies you find. It may be that the small variations in bubble rate have little effect.

Cheers,