Nutrient deficiencies?

Herrwibi

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My current set up is,

40 gallon tank
Pressurised co2( drop checker is always like green).
Running ei dosing.

I'm currently having an issue with a few things in my tank.

I apologise for the picture quality my phone seems to be changing the colour of the picture.

The first problem is my sessiliflora limnophila. I think this was my own doing. I planted everything too close together as you can see the bottom of the plant most of the stems are dying I think ? Although they are growing above this which I am going to trim and replant and remove the rest.

Am I right in saying this died due to not getting enough light ? Also is there a slight deficiency there . Sorry for the bad lighting on the picture.

My next issue is my Anubias. I recently removed this from the substrate and attached it to drift wood. As you can see there are several holes and the leaves are beginning to shed themself .

Any information on this too ?

Thank you.
 

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Oldguy

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Welcome to the Green Side.

Plants look stressed. Light levels intensity/photo-period length may have out stripped CO2 supply/distribution. Try moving you drop checker around the tank looking for dead spots.

Very difficult to get uniform conditions. Have you got x10 flow ie 40x10 gals/hr in the tank. A spray bar at the back pushing water to the front is a popular way to get all your stem plants waving in the current.
 

ian_m

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Generally mechanical damage to plants is a sign of poor CO2 levels and distribution, especially low down in the tank. Could of course be something having a munch, but poor CO2, for your light levels is my bet.

What is your filtration rate, needs to be at least 400 gallons per hour, preferably from a spray bar across whole width of back of chance to stand any chance of getting decent CO2 levels and distribution. Your drop checker maybe green due to CO2 where you have positioned it, but plants speak otherwise.
 

Tom Michael

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How long before lights on does your CO2 come on? Each aquarium is different, but to rule out this being an issue I would suggest you start with 4 hours before - from my experience optimal CO2 saturation at the point lights come on is essential.
 

Konsa

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Hi
Limnophila Sessiliflora is one of the most bullet proof plants out there.I have seen it once to behave like that and it was flow related issue in lower part of the tank.
It grows well in all sorts of conditions (with or without CO2 under low or high light even in plain Argos playsand that is too fine)
As others have suggested will be helpfull to share more detail on your setup.
What light U have and for how long.What ferts U use and how U dose.Filtration (circulation arround the tank).CO2 times and injection metod.
Regards Konsa
 

Herrwibi

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Thanks all for the information .

I currently use an all pond solution 1000l/h . The filter has dropped off over the past year and I am looking at replacing it with an eheim 2217 at the end of the month . I'm hoping with my new filter at the end of the month I'll attach my inline atomizer instead of using my in tank bazooka.

I currently run an extra 500l/h powerhead which my co2 bazooka atomizer is feeding into .

My spray bar runs length ways from side to side .

Photo period is 8 hours with co2 coming on an hour before lights on and going off an hour before lights off and the co2 drop checker is green .

If it is mechanical damage it does make sense . You'll see the current photo of where my power head is and the Anubias is getting hammered by it . The red circle that I'll put in the photo is where my old 600l/h powerhead use to be so the sessiliflora was swaying significantly before .

I use a 50w light chihiros a series .

I'd you guys agree in the picture I'll move my power head up half way in the tank so it's currentlt not pushing against any plans and move my drop checker down to where the sessillisess limnophila.

I follow the same dosing as aquarium plant UK . Currently dosing 35ml

What else would you all recommend doing ?
 

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Simon Cole

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The anubias can look like that if it has been nibbled by your livestock. Maybe feed some boiled broccoli.
The limnophila can grow like that without enough light. It also behaves a bit like this without adequate nitrogen and phosphorous, but I suspect the lighting is holding it back.
I would agree with Konsa, as I never noticed any issues regarding carbon dioxide with either of these plants.
 

Herrwibi

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The anubias can look like that if it has been nibbled by your livestock. Maybe feed some boiled broccoli.
The limnophila can grow like that without enough light. It also behaves a bit like this without adequate nitrogen and phosphorous, but I suspect the lighting is holding it back.
I would agree with Konsa, as I never noticed any issues regarding carbon dioxide with either of these plants.
I'm currently moving my bubble counter around to see if there is any dead spots . I'm going to trim the sessiliflora today and replant .

Would you suggest upping my lighting as I currently have it on a decreased setting and increase my macro nutrients or should I do one at a time and watch how the plants react ?

I can up my dosing of macro's . I'm not saying my API test kit is right but from what it says my nitrates are at 160ppm +. I know alot of people don't believe in the results from the test kits .
 
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dw1305

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Hi all,
The anubias can look like that if it has been nibbled by your livestock.
That was my first thought as well, it looks very much like plec damage, @Herrwibi do you have a Bristlenose (Ancistrus sp.)?
The limnophila can grow like that without enough light. It also behaves a bit like this without adequate nitrogen and phosphorous, but I suspect the lighting is holding it back.
I use a 50w light chihiros a series
I wonder about light, it might be spread rather than intensity.

I've had a Chiros A 301 (18W) on a 30cm cube and it was bright, but not incredibly over powered. I wonder if you aren't getting sufficient light spread.

cheers Darrel
 

Herrwibi

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Hi all, That was my first thought as well, it looks very much like plec damage, @Herrwibi do you have a Bristlenose (Ancistrus sp.)?I wonder about light, it might be spread rather than intensity.

I've had a Chiros A 301 (18W) on a 30cm cube and it was bright, but not incredibly over powered. I wonder if you aren't getting sufficient light spread.

cheers Darrel
I do have bn plecs. Not seen them feeding on the plants but it could be happening at night time when I don't see them .

Well I think your right on the light spread . The issue I have is I use 10mm polycarbonate on top of my tank . I think the light is refracted rather than going straight down.

This afternoon when I was stripping the tank down and replanting all of my plants with the light on top without the cover my plants started to pearl almost instantly .

I maybe need to look at an alternative. Was your chiros on max setting ? I do see parts of the tank that are darker than others .

As stated above I had to edit my post . My API test kit is reading 160ppm + on nitrates . I know alot of people believe these test kits are inaccurate for nitrate testing .

I've taken two photos to show the quality of light in my tank with and without my cover .
 
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dw1305

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Hi all,
I do have bn plecs
Definitely them. Do you feed them some vegetables? They really like Red pepper, Courgette, Broccoli stalks etc.
I've taken two photos to show the quality of light in my tank with and without my cover
Plant health looks pretty reasonable on the images. Can you run it without the polycarbonate sheets? (or swap them for glass sliders?)
Was your chiros on max setting ?
It was. I don't care too much about aquascapes or aesthetics, so if I have a brighter light I just have more plants and particularly floating ones.
My API test kit is reading 160ppm + on nitrates .
I'm not an EI user, but it may be possible if nitrate levels are continually rising. Do you have a conductivity meter? They are really useful, have a look at the <"No water changes...."> thread and links.

cheers Darrel
 

Herrwibi

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Hi all, Definitely them. Do you feed them some vegetables? They really like Red pepper, Courgette, Broccoli stalks etc. Plant health looks pretty reasonable on the images. Can you run it without the polycarbonate sheets? (or swap them for glass sliders?)It was. I don't care too much about aquascapes or aesthetics, so if I have a brighter light I just have more plants and particularly floating ones. I'm not an EI user, but it may be possible if nitrate levels are continually rising. Do you have a conductivity meter? They are really useful, have a look at the <"No water changes...."> thread and links.

cheers Darrel
I use to feed them courgette but not I just fees them algae Waffers. Feel like I might need to start adding them back in .

I could but I'm just worried about the fish jumping out when I'm not here .

I don't but I have then at work . I'm going to take a sample to the local fish store and see what readings they get and go from there . What kind of conductivity am I looking for ? .
 

dw1305

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Hi all,
Feel like I might need to start adding them back in .
I'd definitely give them some vegetables, they do much better with vegetables in their diet.
What kind of conductivity am I looking for ?
There isn't a single figure, it depends on the water you start with. I aim for the range 80 - 150 microS, because <"that works for me"> and I start with rain-water. I have good quality tap water, from a deep limestone aquifer, but (because of the dissolved Ca++ and HCO3- ions) if I used that in the tanks my starting conductivity value would be ~650 microS.

You should be able to get a figure from your water supplier for your tap water, because you are in Scotland I'm expecting fairly soft water with low conductivity, probably below 150 microS. This is your first datum value.

After you've added your fertilisers conductivity will rise (plants can only take up nutrients as ions, and ions are what conductivity measures), this is your second datum point and the value you are aiming for, I use a conductivity range rather than a single figure (~50 microS either way). When you are happy with plant growth (and fish health) measure the conductivity again.

If conductivity keeps rising over time you need to either up the water changes, or add less nutrients, until you have a larger plant mass.

cheers Darrel
 

Simon Cole

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I would be really interested to see if the brighter lighting has very much of an impact on the growth of Limnophila sessiliflora, so please could you give me an update after they have grown a bit. It would really help me to understand different lighting specifications.
 

Pepsi Dave

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I've added some of these plants to my tank recently. I'm probably at about 1.5-2wpg, no CO2, but dosing EI ferts but at a muchly rate than a "High Tech" tank.
My plants are fine, bright green, and very bushy growth (I'll try and post pics later) but they are nowhere near as tall as yours. I trim mine regularly, which might be why I've got a different growth pattern. I'd trim them right down, maybe by as much as 2/3 and maybe set a height at which point you'll trim them, and over time increase the height at which you trim them, this might make them less "leggy".

Edit: It looks like my reply is a bit late, and you've already re-planted etc. I'd be intrigued to see how your plants react to your changes!
 
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