EdwinK
Member
Don't go the economy way please. It is the only thing you will be unable to change in the future without a restart.
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Don't go the economy way please. It is the only thing you will be unable to change in the future without a restart.
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Darwin88
Guest
I'm afraid I've got to consider it. If I was setting up a small planted tank, I wouldn't bat an eyelid at buying the right stuff. But a tank footprint of 1500mm X 450mm with a substrate depth of 50mm works out as just over 30 litres.
30 litres of the previously mentioned hard moler clay comes to £22 including delivery. Compare that to the price of the proper stuff and it's vastly cheaper.
I'm hoping to find out what the difference between this and specialist planted aquarium substrates is. It has a decent CEC, it doesn't contain any additives or chemicals and it shares a similar structure to planted substrates.
Is it just the label and it's intended use that creates this price difference?
What substrate do you use?
Thanks
EdwinK
Member
I have a slightly bigger tank - 1500x500 mm. What bothers me most about all clay based substrates is colour. They have high CEC, that is true, but they do not have water softening and pH adjusting capabilities. In first weeks or months they soak almost every fertilizer you add and then one day suddenly start to release them. So problems are preprogrammed if you are not careful enough. I started with AS and then decided to go economy way with all kind of substrates (plain gravel, gravel with peat, Akadama, JBL Manado, Ebi) but decided to stick with AS because of things mentioned above.
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Darwin88
Guest
Thanks for that. I'm going to read deeply into it and try to dig up more information, I'm not rushing into buying anything until I've weighed up the pros and cons. I appreciate you sharing your thoughts on it though.
Lindy
Member
Hi, I am in the middle of setting up a tank similar to yours. It is 150x60x60cm and had a sump. I blocked off the sump and will be using external filters instead. Lighting wise I looked at lots of options. One of our members (DTL) has the same size tank and runs 2 of the 100cm aquabars on it for his low tech tank. I decided to try DSUNY leds as I liked how they could be programmed for sunrise/sunset etc and 4 channels for getting the colour they way you want it. Your Java fern probably is growing but it is so stealthy you only notice the plant has doubled in size when you take it out. Many folk use akadama and cat litter and love it. If you don't like the colour you could always have sand at the front. I've chosen pool filter sand and must say I love the colour and grain size.
I will vouch for that as well.
I now wish I had bought a better quality substrate, than the Fluval Stratum stuff I have now as I feel it is too light. It was also much cheaper. First problem is it won't stay banked, the water movement within the tank meant any banking, despite using dividers and rocks means it always washes itself to flat. 2nd issue is as it is lighter it makes planting harder, the plants easily tend to float free when inserted with tweezers and things like HC carpets are a constantly uprooting, a right pain.
Definitely not as dense as Ada Aqua Soil and the JBL substrate both of which I have had a go planting in, at planted tank setup demos. With these expensive substrates the plants were far far easier to plant when placed with tweezers, and when tank was full and flowing the plants did not float free.
Too late for me now.
I suspect your estimate of 30l and about 50% out, especially if you intend to have any banking of the substrate....I ended up using x2 the amount of substrate I initially estimated. You can always put a layer of sand (with ferts in it ?) underneath to save costs.
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Darwin88
Guest
A huge chunk of the tank footprint is taken up by rock, I have a number of large rocks in there at the moment and I'm going to leave those is place, so they would displace the substrate somewhat stretching it further.
Wouldn't a base of sand become compact and stagnant?
No idea. I assume it isn't a problem, as my fish & plants are still alive. Many people do this, including filling tights with sand to act as infill for banked scapes.
Wisey
Member
- Joined
- 19 Jul 2014
- Messages
- 1,062
I used tights filled with cheap pea shingle to build up the height at the back of my scape, worth considering if you want any higher sections. Can also act like a cushion to put hardscape on as you can see in the first page or two of my journal linked below. The only mistake I made was I tied them so tight that my bogwood sat on it, rather than embedding in to it for more stability.
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Darwin88
Guest
Now we're discussing real planting substrates again, what's the consensus on Caribsea Eco-complete? Comes up a lot on the forums but very mixed opinions about it? I ask because it seems to be the most economical to buy at £25 per 9 litres.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Darwin88
Guest
I've talked myself out of this one, not nutrient rich enough for crypts apparently. Am I making this overly complex? Or is choosing the right substrate this complicated for everyone?!
Wisey
Member
- Joined
- 19 Jul 2014
- Messages
- 1,062
Before my rescape I was using Tropica plant growth substrate capped with Unipac sand. My Crypts did not grow well at all, they seemed healthy, but very small. When I rescaped I therefore decided to try a nutrient rich substrate, Tropica Aqua Soil (Didn't go ADA as I wanted to put fish back in so didnt want the amonia leaching substrate). My Crypts are double the size, if not more. Thats with the same level of EI dosing as before, a little more light admittedly, but I am sure the substrate has made a huge difference.
As people have said, you can mess around with other thigns afterwards, but changing the substrate means starting from scratch. Defo invest in a decent substrate.
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Darwin88
Guest
I'm looking at Aqua soil Amazonia now, it's actually not too badly priced, I had it in my head that it was like £50 a bag. At £27 a bag from TGM, I could do away with all the doubts and be happy.
But then I'll alway look at clay based cat litter type substrates and think - I could have saved myself £100+ by not paying for a label.
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Darwin88
Guest
Oh, and if you are worried about spending an extra £100, this is not the hobby for you, haha
Haha! I'm not allowed to throw money away anymore, we've got our first baby on the way and apparently they're expensive!
I am sorry to poop your bubble but in pictures
What you are expecting...
What will happen in practice...
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Darwin88
Guest
I'm not expecting anything else I'm sure it'll be a little bundle of joy that will change our lives forever....but it won't stop me grumbling when my aquariums have to make do with economy options while our child rides around in luxury designer prams!
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I'm sure it'll be a little bundle of joy that will change our lives forever....but it won't stop me grumbling when my aquariums have to make do with economy options while our child rides around in luxury designer prams!Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Wisey
Member
- Joined
- 19 Jul 2014
- Messages
- 1,062
Haha, best wishes for the new addition to the family! My fish and shrimps are my kids at the moment, although Mrs Wisey gives me a strange look when I say that. We're getting married in August, so have the real kids to look forward to at some point.
Lindy
Member
I hate to say it but if there is a baby due soon I wouldn't set this tank up until baby is at least 6mths old and you have some sort of routine. You are going to be more tired than you could ever imagine and your tank will get neglected and end up a mess. I would recommend ada amazonia for the few extra £ a bag it is well worth it.
