259L bookcase rebirth

[Westyggx]

259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

Do you get full dissolving and no gas bubble build up?

Don't think so what is it that I would be looking for, for a build up?

 

[greenink]

259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

I get half the chamber being gas by the time it ends - which then slowly dissolves back in overnight, leading (I think) to huge co2 instability against lights

You've convinced me though... Will remove media tomorrow. And then can switch it back to the pump loop not the filter one and stop the flow drain on the filter.

Fingers crossed.

 

[JohnC]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

RE: putting a atomiser in line before your filter. I understand this is not done for a couple of reasons. I think the CO2 over time attacks the rubber seals on the filter reducing their life. Secondly you might end up with CO2 pockets inside the filter reducing it's performance and making it noisy.

 

[greenink]

259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

RE: putting a atomiser in line before your filter. I understand this is not done for a couple of reasons. I think the CO2 over time attacks the rubber seals on the filter reducing their life. Secondly you might end up with CO2 pockets inside the filter reducing it's performance and making it noisy.

Works fine for me in my smaller tank! There are lots of threads on here that say its basically fine, and I find gives v clear water, with no filter noise.

 

[Antipofish]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

I use it without any media and it works well, although you do get the swishing noise but by the time I come home from the gym it's starting to calm down.

Mike what do you think causes the swishing noise ? Could it be that the reactor chamber is not completely full of water ? (In which case releasing the gas release tap until water spurts out would solve i) ? Or is it just the velocity of water running through the chamber ? (again could this be eradicated by vibration dampening behind the bracket or even something to surround the entire chamber to soundproof it ?).

I dont see the point of using an inline diffuser AND a reactor. Seems to be duplicating the effort. Very frustrating though.

 

[greenink]

259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

Bubbles of gas as the water enters the reactor

 

[Antipofish]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

Bubbles of gas as the water enters the reactor

Elaborate?

 

[Westyggx]

259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

Bubbles of gas as the water enters the reactor

Basically once my co2 turns on my reactor makes a noise obviously from the co2 dissolving Into the water, once co2 is shut off it goes quite about an hour later ones all co2 is purged from the reactor.

 

[Antipofish]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

Bubbles of gas as the water enters the reactor

Basically once my co2 turns on my reactor makes a noise obviously from the co2 dissolving Into the water, once co2 is shut off it goes quite about an hour later ones all co2 is purged from the reactor.

Really ? thats pretty annoying, although its during the day so tolerable I guess. I got the sloshing noise even before I added CO2 IT was the flow loss that broke the camels back for me though.

 

[Westyggx]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

Bubbles of gas as the water enters the reactor

Basically once my co2 turns on my reactor makes a noise obviously from the co2 dissolving Into the water, once co2 is shut off it goes quite about an hour later ones all co2 is purged from the reactor.

Really ? thats pretty annoying, although its during the day so tolerable I guess. I got the sloshing noise even before I added CO2 IT was the flow loss that broke the camels back for me though.

Yeh its fine for me, although now you mention BBA i actually get BBA on my wood and plants which would suggest maybe the reactor is not doing a good enough job distributing the Co2..

Flow is fine for me as i have an 80x35x45 so it is perfect on full setting.

 

[greenink]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

Have now removed all media from the AM1000 and put back on the loop with the external pump. Is noticeably noisier than with the media I had in before, and is giving out a fine mist, rather like an UP Atomiser.

Can't be bothered to change it again so will live with this for a few days.

Think the set-up I had earlier was better, to be honest - so am going to go with the UP Atomiser into the AM1000 - hoping that will give total dissolving CO2 on a loop with an external pump (keeping the filter free from anything blocking flow) and not getting the atomiser / diffuser clogged. So frustrating.

Did a pretty big reshape today too, moving various plants around, putting in some stems, trying to create more depth. Photos when the water's cleared.

 

[Antipofish]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

Have now removed all media from the AM1000 and put back on the loop with the external pump. Is noticeably noisier than with the media I had in before, and is giving out a fine mist, rather like an UP Atomiser. Can't be bothered to change it again so will live with this for a few days.

Think the set-up I had earlier was better, to be honest - so may well end up ditching it altogether for an UP Atomiser into the filter. So frustrating.

I know what you mean. Does the mist in the tank bother you Mike ? If not I suggest considering having the atomiser on the outlet as mine used to burp like mad when I had it on the inlet. It depends how much gas you are shoving through of course, and i didn't think I was adding that much

 

[greenink]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

Hate the mist

 

[greenink]

Photo update

Quick photo update:

Have moved the tallest stone on the left forwards a bit, and the others back to create some room behind, and planted rotala stems in the space. Hoping this will give some more depth to the scape.

Seriously need to scrub those rocks. They've completely changed colour... Some of it is the underexposed photo but blimey.

 

[Antipofish]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

Hate the mist

Fair call. You don't subscribe to the "CO2 bubbles get absorbed by the plant leaves better than totally dissolve CO2" theory then ?

 

[greenink]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

CO2 is now stable and BBA etc is starting to go down, and HC is on the way to recovery. The AM1000 with no media is giving ok diffusion - creating mist that looks very like an UP atomiser in fact - but with far too much noise of the water splashing about in the bubbles. So far would say that just an UP atomiser alone would be more sensible (and cheaper), and that an UP atomiser on the filter inlet hose gives the best water clarity of all with great diffusion (based on my small tank).

But in the spirit of endless tinkering , have ordered a 16/22 UP atomiser from HK, which has arrived:

Am going to pop that inline before the AM1000 (with no media) as the way of injecting CO2 into it, and close off the CO2 intake of the AM1000, in the hope that this gives the best of all worlds - crystal clear water with good diffusion, in a separate loop from the filter, driven by an external pump.

 

[Antipofish]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

Mike, over what timescale would you say you have noticed a turnaround ? My plants seem to be suffering CO2 related issues (some leaves with holes, some with damaged / disintegrating edges and that horrid "dirty" algae that I am told is associated with new tanks (even though mine has been running for 3 months now so could be considered "middle aged" in relation to some tanks on here which seem to hit the ground running ). And I am hoping that by upping CO2, I may see improvements but dont know what timescale to expect it. I will be putting up a post about this in the CO2 section later, so feel free to reply on there rather than here as I dont want to hijack your topic.

 

[greenink]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

Mike, over what timescale would you say you have noticed a turnaround ?

A week or two, but it's subtle. For example, this HC was pretty much all dark green and on the way to dead ten days ago. (Sorry for poor photo, is a crop from a FTS)

And now it's like this:

...so not in any way totally fixed but definitely on the way to recovery. There were no light green shoots at all ten days ago after a prolonged melt.

It's doing even better in the smaller tank (where I transplanted some to test recovery with higher CO2 levels I have in there - although it has fresher molar clay substrate that hasn't had chance to absorb many ferts from EI dosing, which suggests it's CO2 rather than ferts).

The things I've changed in the big tank are:

1. upping (and getting stable) the CO2
2. moving the CO2 earlier so it's absolutely lime green the second lights go on
3. doing a bit more rigorous substrate vacuuming - there was quite a lot of crud - perhaps my substrate bacteria haven't colonised properly yet

 

[O'Neil]

Re: 259L bookcase tank - CO2 diffusion issues

I had the same problem with HC, I upped the CO2 a little and it started to bounce back a bit, then I added a better pump and got a spurt of new growth, I think and correct me if I'm wrong but CO2 and circulation seem to be key with this plant.

 

[greenink]

How pumps work - help please!

Need help on pumps - any engineers out there? My set up is this:

Intake > AM1000 > Eheim 3000 pump > Hydor > Outlet

I thought it made no difference where the pump was in a loop, as I'd assumed the pressure was the same all the way through (or something!)

I think it might turn out it does make a difference: the flow prior to the pump is (I understand) 'powered' by atmospheric pressure, equivalent to 14.7 PSI or a water column of 34 feet. The pump creates a vacuum just before the impeller blade, and atmospheric pressure pushes the water through - so it essentially works by suction. That's why it's literally impossible to suck water up more than 34 feet.

The flow after the pump is (additionally) powered by the pump motor, which is I have now calculated 4.33 PSI, based on it's ability to deliver a pump head of 3m/10ft).

So where should the AM1000 go if I want the greatest flow through the whole system? After or before the pump? Does it actually matter?

Can anyone with an engineering background help explain this? How does the pump work, is the pressure before and after it the same, and does it make a difference to flow whether an AM1000 is before or after it?